Fic Talk > General Discussion
The Writing Thread: Orlando Passaggio (aka The Writing Thread 3)
RokofAges75:
--- Quote from: nicksgal on May 22, 2021, 03:36:16 PM ---And they were all really active here on the forums too. It was nice talking about some things that didn't involve Nick every now and again, lol. You're right, it probably has nothing to do with him being a great character and more to do with his regular following, lol.
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Yeah, while I don't mind talking mostly about Nick, the variety was nice!
--- Quote from: nicksgal on May 22, 2021, 03:36:16 PM ---There's always someone who will read it! :) That's part of the beauty of fanfic. I wonder if the longer one would be more popular than the shorter one? More Nowie to enjoy? When you re-post your older fanfics, what do you do? Chapter every day? Chunks on a certain day?
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Yeah maybe. It would at least get noticed more by being among the recently updated stories for longer. I try to post a chapter a day of the older ones because they're so long that if I only did a chapter a week, they would take over a year to post. I don't see the point of drawing them out that long when anyone who wants to read them for the first time could just browse on over to my site or AC and read the rest at any time.
--- Quote from: nicksgal on May 22, 2021, 03:36:16 PM ---Just make one of them have a medical fetish of some sort. Boom! In your wheelhouse and kinky, lol.
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LOL Now there's an idea. Which one do you think is more likely to have a medical fetish? Nick seems to have an interest in medical science and technology lately (before he switched to cryptocurrency, anyway), but I feel like Brian could have some secret kinks we don't know about.
--- Quote from: nicksgal on May 22, 2021, 03:36:16 PM ---That's awesome! Now we just have to convince them to write fanfics, lol. I'm glad you have a brand new follower (or a less shy follower). Maybe it's a bit of both? Happy our Boys were able to bridge the age gap. I wonder if younger fans have favorites or if they just like the group collectively?
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I dunno... all I know is the younger fan giving me feedback seems to be a Nick girl and does not like Brian. So maybe they do still have favorites.
--- Quote from: nicksgal on May 22, 2021, 03:36:16 PM ---I feel like if they know, they try to avoid thinking about it too much, lol.
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LOL Yes, exactly. Much like "Don't Google yourself."
--- Quote from: nicksgal on May 22, 2021, 03:36:16 PM ---So you were very much into outlining by the time Broken came around! I think having some sort of plan, whether that's an outline or something else, is important when writing with other people, that way everyone is on the same page. I get wanting to make sure that your "another x story" needs to stand out in quality from the ones before it, so it makes sense that research would be the key there. As a non-outliner (for the most part), I can see it helping in quality too, but I don't want to say it definitely makes a story better (because then what am I doing with my writing 90% of the time? lol) If anything, I'd say I'm a post-outliner, then I can go back and easily remember where I last referenced something or the last time a character dealt with whatever. That's not to say that I have no plan, but... I'd rather just write and see what happens. Nick always changes my plans anyway, lol.
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Yeah, I guess so. I had done it for part of two stories, anyway LOL. I do think outlines of some kind are even more important for a collab. I don't think it definitely makes a story better; that all depends on the writer and what kind of story it is. With some stories, I need an outline to keep track of the timeline and how different pieces of the plot are going to fit together. With others, I could probably just write with a plan in my head like I used to and be fine. I don't think outlining is the only thing that helped my writing mature; I think reading and researching and life experience and age all helped with that too.
I get what you mean about post-outlining too. Many of my outlines, especially for my medical dramas and stories that take place in a specific BSB time period, take on the form of a timeline so I can keep track of when things happened... how long it's been since a certain event or when an upcoming event needs to happen. That is super helpful so I'm not constantly searching back through the story to piece together the timeline.
--- Quote from: nicksgal on May 22, 2021, 03:36:16 PM ---I love how Nick's trying to schedule his job when he has a one month old and two other children. You should know better, Nick, lol.
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LOL I know. It's nice of him to come on at all. He eventually did get back on Twitch for about half an hour.
--- Quote from: nicksgal on May 22, 2021, 03:36:16 PM ---I hope you finished your sentence this morning! ;D
I meant to comment on this part yesterday and forgot. I think the tired was setting in... But I wish she'd weigh in too! I think our efforts to summon her like Beetlejuice are not working, lol.
And now for Saturday...
How's writing going today? (I'm guessing well since you haven't updated yet.)
I finished my Nick and Brian scenes for this chapter and started the Kevin one, then really wanted to take a shower, then sort of thought about the chapter and switched to my ideas for my next author talk, then came back to write, then wanted lunch, and now I'm here, lol.
Why do I always procrastinate on Kevin scenes? I'm sorry, Kevin! It would be a much shorter novel if I only focused on Nick, lol. I might just go set myself a timer and make myself word sprint and focus on Kevin...
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I did! I finished my chapter! ;D So yes, it was going well, and that's why I didn't update until afternoon.
I'm glad you finished your Nick and Brian scenes! I would probably procrastinate on Kevin too unless his part was more interesting than theirs. In my current story, I've been enjoying the Kevin chapters more because his storyline is more interesting to me than Nick's.
Good luck with your word sprint! I would sprint with you, but I have to get ready. My mom just retired, so my family's going out to dinner to celebrate tonight!
nicksgal:
--- Quote from: RokofAges75 on May 22, 2021, 04:28:20 PM ---Yeah maybe. It would at least get noticed more by being among the recently updated stories for longer. I try to post a chapter a day of the older ones because they're so long that if I only did a chapter a week, they would take over a year to post. I don't see the point of drawing them out that long when anyone who wants to read them for the first time could just browse on over to my site or AC and read the rest at any time.
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I think to really get shorter stories noticed, especially on AO3 where it's part of the culture, you really have to utilize the tags. Which is harder for us that are in the "tags are for genres" camp. I think the more searchable you make it, the easier it is for people to find it. Though I'm thinking now what tags I would use for PBox and all the ones that come to mind are not useful to the story and just me making jokes, like "I once thought it was out of the norm for me to write fluffy romance, has anyone read this?" Or "Nick overreacts to everything in the most animated way!" Or "I chose not to use warnings because I hate spoilers, but y'all are in for a treat." Or "#TeamDark." Or "I will tell you more than you ever wanted to know about this fanfic, just ask!" Or "Nick's name is lovingly 1% of the words painstakingly written in this story," obviously. When realistically, I could probably just tag it "demons," "crazy worldbuilding," "portal fiction," "wordy," and "character development" and all those things are probably more accurate descriptors of the story and my writing style, lol.
Edited to Add: Speaking of tags, I just a story tagged "non-consensual stabbing" and now I'm wondering... isn't most stabbing non-consensual? I think I'd rather know if it was consensual stabbing, lol.
If it's a long one, just updating it regularly would give people time to see it. I think all of our current stories have been on the first page since we started posting them. I did the same thing for PBox, but just posted chunks of 5-10 chapters for seven weeks (plus my holiday story week), which is ironically the exact same amount of time as if I had just posted one chapter per day, which would've given me longer to edit the later chapters, lol. Should have done that. Oh well. Yeah, I don't think something old should take a year or longer to post either. I'm sure people could find our old stuff elsewhere if they really tried to look.
--- Quote from: RokofAges75 on May 22, 2021, 04:28:20 PM ---LOL Now there's an idea. Which one do you think is more likely to have a medical fetish? Nick seems to have an interest in medical science and technology lately (before he switched to cryptocurrency, anyway), but I feel like Brian could have some secret kinks we don't know about.
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Here's my crazy take: Brian has the fetish (as he has some secret kinks for sure), but Nick is fascinated by his fetish due to his interest in medical science, lol. Obviously Nick's fetish is cryptocurrency . If only there was a way to combine the two. Brian buys specialized medical equipment with cryptocurrency? lmao
--- Quote from: RokofAges75 on May 22, 2021, 04:28:20 PM ---I dunno... all I know is the younger fan giving me feedback seems to be a Nick girl and does not like Brian. So maybe they do still have favorites.
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Interesting! It's easy to enjoy Nick and he's the most accessible, so I get it. However, this younger fan needs to read some 90's fanfic Brian, because he is a gem! Not that I feel like you write even present day Brian as a total dick, just slightly more flawed. :angel:: DBADLEKYA! Oh, there's guardian angel Nick popping by! lol
--- Quote from: RokofAges75 on May 22, 2021, 04:28:20 PM ---LOL Yes, exactly. Much like "Don't Google yourself."
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Sound advice! You know, I haven't googled myself since getting married, but in the past, I was very lucky to share a name with someone much more famous than I, so I never came up unless you deep scrolled, lol.
--- Quote from: RokofAges75 on May 22, 2021, 04:28:20 PM ---Yeah, I guess so. I had done it for part of two stories, anyway LOL. I do think outlines of some kind are even more important for a collab. I don't think it definitely makes a story better; that all depends on the writer and what kind of story it is. With some stories, I need an outline to keep track of the timeline and how different pieces of the plot are going to fit together. With others, I could probably just write with a plan in my head like I used to and be fine. I don't think outlining is the only thing that helped my writing mature; I think reading and researching and life experience and age all helped with that too.
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An outline is probably hugely important with a timeline and it would definitely make keeping track of what to plan for event-wise in the pacing. I think it's probably a combination of a lot of things, but I'd say all of those are helpful for better writing, especially personal life experience, then there's more background knowledge to draw from and specific feelings or reactions.
--- Quote from: RokofAges75 on May 22, 2021, 04:28:20 PM ---I get what you mean about post-outlining too. Many of my outlines, especially for my medical dramas and stories that take place in a specific BSB time period, take on the form of a timeline so I can keep track of when things happened... how long it's been since a certain event or when an upcoming event needs to happen. That is super helpful so I'm not constantly searching back through the story to piece together the timeline.
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Exactly! I use it for plot elements or character development things for the most part, but I have a general chapter-by-chapter, scene-by-scene outline that I refer to fairly often since I like making callbacks or having someone remember a direct quote.
I can see where a timeline would be helpful for a medical drama, especially if you need something like "recovery from surgery" or "lots of doctor visits." And I've already mentioned how in awe I am of y'all keeping track of BSB time.
--- Quote from: RokofAges75 on May 22, 2021, 04:28:20 PM ---LOL I know. It's nice of him to come on at all. He eventually did get back on Twitch for about half an hour.
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It is. I would totally understand if he took a break from social media for a while.
--- Quote from: RokofAges75 on May 22, 2021, 04:28:20 PM ---I did! I finished my chapter! ;D So yes, it was going well, and that's why I didn't update until afternoon.
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One more chapter done! That's so exciting! Isn't that two this past week? Or is that three now? You're on a roll just in time for summer to hit! One more week! (Unless y'all go past memorial day this year.)
--- Quote from: RokofAges75 on May 22, 2021, 04:28:20 PM ---I'm glad you finished your Nick and Brian scenes! I would probably procrastinate on Kevin too unless his part was more interesting than theirs. In my current story, I've been enjoying the Kevin chapters more because his storyline is more interesting to me than Nick's.
Good luck with your word sprint! I would sprint with you, but I have to get ready. My mom just retired, so my family's going out to dinner to celebrate tonight!
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You know, they were all equally interesting, I just wasn't as sure on exact details for Kevin's (having not started writing it at that moment), but I ended up finishing it without the word sprint once I really sat down to write and starting the next chapter! So now I only have eight chapters left to write and so far this chapter is writing itself. I'm still laughing at Nick so much.
Congratulation s to your mom! That's so exciting! :party:
RokofAges75:
--- Quote from: nicksgal on May 22, 2021, 09:55:04 PM ---I think to really get shorter stories noticed, especially on AO3 where it's part of the culture, you really have to utilize the tags. Which is harder for us that are in the "tags are for genres" camp. I think the more searchable you make it, the easier it is for people to find it. Though I'm thinking now what tags I would use for PBox and all the ones that come to mind are not useful to the story and just me making jokes, like "I once thought it was out of the norm for me to write fluffy romance, has anyone read this?" Or "Nick overreacts to everything in the most animated way!" Or "I chose not to use warnings because I hate spoilers, but y'all are in for a treat." Or "#TeamDark." Or "I will tell you more than you ever wanted to know about this fanfic, just ask!" Or "Nick's name is lovingly 1% of the words painstakingly written in this story," obviously. When realistically, I could probably just tag it "demons," "crazy worldbuilding," "portal fiction," "wordy," and "character development" and all those things are probably more accurate descriptors of the story and my writing style, lol.
Edited to Add: Speaking of tags, I just a story tagged "non-consensual stabbing" and now I'm wondering... isn't most stabbing non-consensual? I think I'd rather know if it was consensual stabbing, lol.
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Yeah, I think you're right about the tags. I wondered if I included more tags that revealed more about the subject matter of my stories (like "Cancer" for Curtain Call), would it attract more readers? But then I tried searching by said topics, and there are literally no other BSB stories (or very few, in some cases) with that tag. The best I found was "hospitals" or "medical" - there are 23 and 13 BSB stories for those tags, respectively. I just don't think my kind of drama - or fantasy - or longfics in general - are popular there. And that's okay. At least it allows the few people who do read to leave reviews.
It would be interesting to do an experiment with the same story posted twice, once with everything tagged and once with nothing but the bare minimum, and see if there's a drastic difference in the response it gets. But I'm not sure how one would do that without spamming by posting the same story twice.
I did look under Additional Tags in the Sort By box to see what came up, and it looks like the most popular tags among BSB stories are:
Romance (130)
Drama (127)
Alternate Universe (124)
Anal Sex (122)
Angst (112)
Oral Sex (72)
Sex (68)
Hurt/Comfort (66)
Fluff (63)
Slash (52)
That about says it all right there... genres and sex. Lots of sex LOL.
--- Quote from: nicksgal on May 22, 2021, 09:55:04 PM ---Edited to Add: Speaking of tags, I just a story tagged "non-consensual stabbing" and now I'm wondering... isn't most stabbing non-consensual? I think I'd rather know if it was consensual stabbing, lol.
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There's a fetish for everything, so maybe some people like being stabbed? When I was researching choppage for Broken back in the day, I learned that there are not only amputee fetishists, but there are also people that want to BE an amputee and will go so far as to beg doctors to cut off limbs or hurt themselves to make it happen. So I guess there could be such a thing as consensual stabbing, crazy as it sounds LOL.
--- Quote from: nicksgal on May 22, 2021, 09:55:04 PM ---Here's my crazy take: Brian has the fetish (as he has some secret kinks for sure), but Nick is fascinated by his fetish due to his interest in medical science, lol. Obviously Nick's fetish is cryptocurrency . If only there was a way to combine the two. Brian buys specialized medical equipment with cryptocurrency? lmao
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LOL! Having written a story about medical fetishes somewhat recently, I'm going to stay far away from that one for now. Also, there are zero BSB fics with the "Medical Kink" tag, so I don't know that that would even help. Maybe I'll just start tagging all my stories with "Anal Sex" instead.
--- Quote from: nicksgal on May 22, 2021, 09:55:04 PM ---Interesting! It's easy to enjoy Nick and he's the most accessible, so I get it. However, this younger fan needs to read some 90's fanfic Brian, because he is a gem! Not that I feel like you write even present day Brian as a total dick, just slightly more flawed. :angel:: DBADLEKYA! Oh, there's guardian angel Nick popping by! lol
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I know, it's sad that these young ones didn't get to enjoy Brian at his peak. I could never write Brian as a total dick because I don't see him that way. I just don't see him as a perfect angel anymore either. But that has probably actually been good for my writing because it gives Brian more character flaws and a different perspective from the other boys. In my current story, his belief in God and miracles and the power of prayer has kept him in denial about something that the other guys have accepted, which has caused some tension. But he would probably listen to whatever Guardian Angel Nick says. :angel: "INAOYA!"
--- Quote from: nicksgal on May 22, 2021, 09:55:04 PM ---Exactly! I use it for plot elements or character development things for the most part, but I have a general chapter-by-chapter, scene-by-scene outline that I refer to fairly often since I like making callbacks or having someone remember a direct quote.
I can see where a timeline would be helpful for a medical drama, especially if you need something like "recovery from surgery" or "lots of doctor visits." And I've already mentioned how in awe I am of y'all keeping track of BSB time.
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Yep, I have started doing more of the chapter-by-chapter outline as I go, too. For MBK, I try to plan chapter by chapter a few chapters ahead, and then I just have a list of general ideas and events I want to include later in the story that I add to the chapter-by-chapter outline as they come up.
The most elaborate timeline I ever had was for Curtain Call, in terms of keeping track of a treatment schedule and an entire leg of the This is Us tour.
I was just looking back at some of my old outlines as I was writing this. I keep them all even after I finish the story. I have all of them from BMS on; I lost Broken's outline when my laptop died in college. Anyway, looking back at some of the old ones, I realize they have gotten much more organized over time. My MBK outline is nicely organized with bolded headings and bullet points and even a couple of tables. My BMS outline is a hot mess. It starts with a 19-page list of ideas, which include things like:
Jacuzzi -> sex
Gamecube fun
Nick goes to Cali, meets up with guys – cute parts here
Nick and Aaron part
Then I started keeping track of what happened in each chapter at Chapter 89, and that continues until the end. Then there's a timeline that spans almost five years. Then some random notes about the characters. The whole outline is 30 pages long LOL. My outlining skills have definitely gotten better over the years.
--- Quote from: nicksgal on May 22, 2021, 09:55:04 PM ---One more chapter done! That's so exciting! Isn't that two this past week? Or is that three now? You're on a roll just in time for summer to hit! One more week! (Unless y'all go past memorial day this year.)
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I guess technically this was my second chapter finished this week, since I finished the Nick one I was having a hard time with on Sunday or Monday... I don't even remember now. This latest one went a lot better!
Nope, Friday's my last day, so I'm definitely heading into summer with some momentum. I love that because I usually spend the first week or two of June battling WADD as I try to get back into the writing groove. That shouldn't be a problem for me this year.
--- Quote from: nicksgal on May 22, 2021, 09:55:04 PM ---You know, they were all equally interesting, I just wasn't as sure on exact details for Kevin's (having not started writing it at that moment), but I ended up finishing it without the word sprint once I really sat down to write and starting the next chapter! So now I only have eight chapters left to write and so far this chapter is writing itself. I'm still laughing at Nick so much.
Congratulation s to your mom! That's so exciting! :party:
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Good! You're so close to the end!! I'm glad you're having fun with it tonight.
Thanks!
nicksgal:
--- Quote from: RokofAges75 on May 22, 2021, 11:20:16 PM ---Yeah, I think you're right about the tags. I wondered if I included more tags that revealed more about the subject matter of my stories (like "Cancer" for Curtain Call), would it attract more readers? But then I tried searching by said topics, and there are literally no other BSB stories (or very few, in some cases) with that tag. The best I found was "hospitals" or "medical" - there are 23 and 13 BSB stories for those tags, respectively. I just don't think my kind of drama - or fantasy - or longfics in general - are popular there. And that's okay. At least it allows the few people who do read to leave reviews.
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I don't know. We've talked about the spoilery nature of it, so the part of me that doesn't like spoilers says you should not tag it "cancer," but yes, if people were looking for BSB cancer stories, it would be easier to find if it were tagged. Pros and cons.
It seems like these days novel-length fanfics just aren't the norm in general, especially on AO3. And the ones that are there aren't updated regularly. Now I cannot judge people who write novel-length fanfics and don't update regularly as... well, I took a six month hiatus once four chapters from the end, so... that would be the pot calling the kettle black, lol. And I think the last year of updating was spent on twenty chapters where I probably updated twice in once week and then not at all for a month and half, so... Can't judge them at all. Really writing ahead has saved me from my own bad habits, lol. On your "or fantasy" note, I don't know that fantasy is popular in BSB fanfic land anywhere, lol. It's cool. Unlike in the past where I hated being lumped in with Sci-Fi, I'll cozy up to it and we'll have a rad party that you're all invited to with swords, dragons, and mythical tech! lol
--- Quote from: RokofAges75 on May 22, 2021, 11:20:16 PM ---It would be interesting to do an experiment with the same story posted twice, once with everything tagged and once with nothing but the bare minimum, and see if there's a drastic difference in the response it gets. But I'm not sure how one would do that without spamming by posting the same story twice.
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I think you'd have to make the summary different so people don't notice it's two versions of the same story? That or post a few chapters of SAMS as you would normally tag and track the engagement over a couple weeks or so, then add all the other tags and see if there's a spike in engagement after the tags are added. Happy to make you a spreadsheet, lol.
--- Quote from: RokofAges75 on May 22, 2021, 11:20:16 PM ---I did look under Additional Tags in the Sort By box to see what came up, and it looks like the most popular tags among BSB stories are:
Romance (130)
Drama (127)
Alternate Universe (124)
Anal Sex (122)
Angst (112)
Oral Sex (72)
Sex (68)
Hurt/Comfort (66)
Fluff (63)
Slash (52)
That about says it all right there... genres and sex. Lots of sex LOL.
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The top three are genres! It's not all sex, lol. There's probably crossover in some of those too and the numbers for "slash" are probably not accurate given the number of "anal sex" tags, lol.
--- Quote from: RokofAges75 on May 22, 2021, 11:20:16 PM ---There's a fetish for everything, so maybe some people like being stabbed? When I was researching choppage for Broken back in the day, I learned that there are not only amputee fetishists, but there are also people that want to BE an amputee and will go so far as to beg doctors to cut off limbs or hurt themselves to make it happen. So I guess there could be such a thing as consensual stabbing, crazy as it sounds LOL.
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Oh, I know. I did actually start writing that as "I'm wondering if there's consensual stabbing," but then I thought, well sure, there's probably consensual stabbing? And then my bigger question was if the majority of stabbing was non-consensual, like I assumed, or not, lol. I did know that there were amputee fetishists, actually; I've heard some horror stories from a friend. I did not know that people would beg doctors to cut off their limbs though, but I'm hoping that the doctors did not follow through on that request unless it was medically necessary.
--- Quote from: RokofAges75 on May 22, 2021, 11:20:16 PM ---LOL! Having written a story about medical fetishes somewhat recently, I'm going to stay far away from that one for now. Also, there are zero BSB fics with the "Medical Kink" tag, so I don't know that that would even help. Maybe I'll just start tagging all my stories with "Anal Sex" instead.
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Nothing says you can't have a medical kink and enjoy anal sex! Really, you'd be doing readers a service if you included and tagged both in this hypothetical Frick/Frack medical kink story, then it would be easier to find. :biggrin:
--- Quote from: RokofAges75 on May 22, 2021, 11:20:16 PM ---I know, it's sad that these young ones didn't get to enjoy Brian at his peak. I could never write Brian as a total dick because I don't see him that way. I just don't see him as a perfect angel anymore either. But that has probably actually been good for my writing because it gives Brian more character flaws and a different perspective from the other boys. In my current story, his belief in God and miracles and the power of prayer has kept him in denial about something that the other guys have accepted, which has caused some tension. But he would probably listen to whatever Guardian Angel Nick says. :angel: "INAOYA!"
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I don't see him as a total dick either, just someone with some very different political views from me. And character flaws and different perspectives lead to character growth opportunities for everyone in fictionland (and in real life, I guess), so I think it's better with have a new perspective on Brian's full character. Unless we're Mare. Mare always knew. Ooh, fascinating! I really need to catch up on my fanfic reading, I've just been very focused on finishing PNecklace and not wanting to fall too far astray from it.
I'm having a moment where I can't remember what "INAOYA" is... Help! lol I'd listen to Guardian Angel Nick too, he's got good points and neat tricks!
--- Quote from: RokofAges75 on May 22, 2021, 11:20:16 PM ---Yep, I have started doing more of the chapter-by-chapter outline as I go, too. For MBK, I try to plan chapter by chapter a few chapters ahead, and then I just have a list of general ideas and events I want to include later in the story that I add to the chapter-by-chapter outline as they come up.
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I usually do at the end, especially now with the divergent plotlines. I saw another picture of Charlie and the strings today with the caption "how I outline" versus "how other people outline" with a picture of an organized document and it hit a little too close to home, lol. I had been following my outline accurately, but I added a scene today and it was 100% worth it.
--- Quote from: RokofAges75 on May 22, 2021, 11:20:16 PM ---The most elaborate timeline I ever had was for Curtain Call, in terms of keeping track of a treatment schedule and an entire leg of the This is Us tour.
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I'm imaging how difficult that would be for real Nick while on tour! Did he fly back to his regular doctor every time? I can't imagine he'd have one in every city, that would make even less sense. Those frequent flier miles he would rack up!
--- Quote from: RokofAges75 on May 22, 2021, 11:20:16 PM ---I was just looking back at some of my old outlines as I was writing this. I keep them all even after I finish the story. I have all of them from BMS on; I lost Broken's outline when my laptop died in college. Anyway, looking back at some of the old ones, I realize they have gotten much more organized over time. My MBK outline is nicely organized with bolded headings and bullet points and even a couple of tables. My BMS outline is a hot mess. It starts with a 19-page list of ideas, which include things like:
Jacuzzi -> sex
Gamecube fun
Nick goes to Cali, meets up with guys – cute parts here
Nick and Aaron part
Then I started keeping track of what happened in each chapter at Chapter 89, and that continues until the end. Then there's a timeline that spans almost five years. Then some random notes about the characters. The whole outline is 30 pages long LOL. My outlining skills have definitely gotten better over the years.
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LMAO! I love all of your notes, especially "jacuzzi --> sex" and "cute parts here." This sounds more like how I outline, except I don't think any of it has ever gotten to 30 pages... Though I do keep them in Google Keep with each note labeled about the subject. So it's more like "Character Arcs" then a list of each major character and the overall theme of their arc. And nothing else. I think there's a few times I wrote unrelated ramblings, but they're a couple of sentences at most.
Bolded headings and tables are much more organized than random musings, but I think there's value to random musings too. I say, whatever works for the story. Also BMS was 200 chapters long, so it makes sense that it would have 30 pages of outlining and ideas.
--- Quote from: RokofAges75 on May 22, 2021, 11:20:16 PM ---I guess technically this was my second chapter finished this week, since I finished the Nick one I was having a hard time with on Sunday or Monday... I don't even remember now. This latest one went a lot better!
Nope, Friday's my last day, so I'm definitely heading into summer with some momentum. I love that because I usually spend the first week or two of June battling WADD as I try to get back into the writing groove. That shouldn't be a problem for me this year.
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One chapter in five or six days! Awesome! Glad it went better than the Nick one! Your sick days really helped out. I love those ones where you're just sick enough where you would be unproductive at work, but you can still do little things around the house. Obviously I'd rather not be sick, but in the scale of being sick, those ones are good.
I wonder how much you'll crank out without WADD. I hope that means you'll be really productive! :)
--- Quote from: RokofAges75 on May 22, 2021, 11:20:16 PM ---Good! You're so close to the end!! I'm glad you're having fun with it tonight.
--- End quote ---
I know, it's crazy! It was fun, but my dinner getting delivered derailed me; it's my fault for watching tv while eating.
My Saturdays have been less productive this month and my Sundays have been really productive, so I'm hoping that maybe that means tomorrow will be crazy productive if I already had a good Saturday.
RokofAges75:
--- Quote from: nicksgal on May 23, 2021, 12:20:31 AM ---I don't know. We've talked about the spoilery nature of it, so the part of me that doesn't like spoilers says you should not tag it "cancer," but yes, if people were looking for BSB cancer stories, it would be easier to find if it were tagged. Pros and cons.
It seems like these days novel-length fanfics just aren't the norm in general, especially on AO3. And the ones that are there aren't updated regularly. Now I cannot judge people who write novel-length fanfics and don't update regularly as... well, I took a six month hiatus once four chapters from the end, so... that would be the pot calling the kettle black, lol. And I think the last year of updating was spent on twenty chapters where I probably updated twice in once week and then not at all for a month and half, so... Can't judge them at all. Really writing ahead has saved me from my own bad habits, lol. On your "or fantasy" note, I don't know that fantasy is popular in BSB fanfic land anywhere, lol. It's cool. Unlike in the past where I hated being lumped in with Sci-Fi, I'll cozy up to it and we'll have a rad party that you're all invited to with swords, dragons, and mythical tech! lol
--- End quote ---
Yeah, that's my issue with those kinds of tags too. I hate spoilers. This is why we just need to enjoy writing for ourselves, and if anyone else wants to read our stuff, bonus!
I've been there with the regular updates in the beginning, followed by months of no updates when life gets too busy. Writing ahead and hoarding chapters has really helped me too.
--- Quote from: nicksgal on May 23, 2021, 12:20:31 AM ---I think you'd have to make the summary different so people don't notice it's two versions of the same story? That or post a few chapters of SAMS as you would normally tag and track the engagement over a couple weeks or so, then add all the other tags and see if there's a spike in engagement after the tags are added. Happy to make you a spreadsheet, lol.
--- End quote ---
That's probably the way to go if I want to try it - start with normal tags and then add on later and see if it makes a difference.
--- Quote from: nicksgal on May 23, 2021, 12:20:31 AM ---The top three are genres! It's not all sex, lol. There's probably crossover in some of those too and the numbers for "slash" are probably not accurate given the number of "anal sex" tags, lol.
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Yeah, I'm guessing most of the slash writers don't feel the need to actually include the slash tag because they already have the character tag that implies it's a slash, like Nick Carter/Brian Littrell. The anal sex tag is also a giveaway LOL.
--- Quote from: nicksgal on May 23, 2021, 12:20:31 AM ---Nothing says you can't have a medical kink and enjoy anal sex! Really, you'd be doing readers a service if you included and tagged both in this hypothetical Frick/Frack medical kink story, then it would be easier to find. :biggrin:
--- End quote ---
LOL Very true.
--- Quote from: nicksgal on May 23, 2021, 12:20:31 AM ---I don't see him as a total dick either, just someone with some very different political views from me. And character flaws and different perspectives lead to character growth opportunities for everyone in fictionland (and in real life, I guess), so I think it's better with have a new perspective on Brian's full character. Unless we're Mare. Mare always knew. Ooh, fascinating! I really need to catch up on my fanfic reading, I've just been very focused on finishing PNecklace and not wanting to fall too far astray from it.
I'm having a moment where I can't remember what "INAOYA" is... Help! lol I'd listen to Guardian Angel Nick too, he's got good points and neat tricks!
--- End quote ---
Yes, same. We may not agree politically, but I still love him as a person. I just don't love everything about him.
INAOYA = "I'm not afraid of you anymore!" I was just trying to think of what else Nick says in that scene LOL.
--- Quote from: nicksgal on May 23, 2021, 12:20:31 AM ---I usually do at the end, especially now with the divergent plotlines. I saw another picture of Charlie and the strings today with the caption "how I outline" versus "how other people outline" with a picture of an organized document and it hit a little too close to home, lol. I had been following my outline accurately, but I added a scene today and it was 100% worth it.
--- End quote ---
Outlines should be flexible! I change and add stuff in mine too.
--- Quote from: nicksgal on May 23, 2021, 12:20:31 AM ---I'm imaging how difficult that would be for real Nick while on tour! Did he fly back to his regular doctor every time? I can't imagine he'd have one in every city, that would make even less sense. Those frequent flier miles he would rack up!
--- End quote ---
Yeah... you'd have to read the story to see how he did it, because that was a big part of the story.
--- Quote from: nicksgal on May 23, 2021, 12:20:31 AM ---LMAO! I love all of your notes, especially "jacuzzi --> sex" and "cute parts here." This sounds more like how I outline, except I don't think any of it has ever gotten to 30 pages... Though I do keep them in Google Keep with each note labeled about the subject. So it's more like "Character Arcs" then a list of each major character and the overall theme of their arc. And nothing else. I think there's a few times I wrote unrelated ramblings, but they're a couple of sentences at most.
Bolded headings and tables are much more organized than random musings, but I think there's value to random musings too. I say, whatever works for the story. Also BMS was 200 chapters long, so it makes sense that it would have 30 pages of outlining and ideas.
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Yeah, absolutely. I have evolved to writing more in complete sentences, but when I look back at that BMS outline, I can still make sense of most of that stuff and remember what part of the story it refers to, so it definitely still worked for me. It's fine for an outline to be a rambling mess because no one sees it except you.
--- Quote from: nicksgal on May 23, 2021, 12:20:31 AM ---One chapter in five or six days! Awesome! Glad it went better than the Nick one! Your sick days really helped out. I love those ones where you're just sick enough where you would be unproductive at work, but you can still do little things around the house. Obviously I'd rather not be sick, but in the scale of being sick, those ones are good.
I wonder how much you'll crank out without WADD. I hope that means you'll be really productive! :)
--- End quote ---
Agreed, those are the best kind of sick days! Sometimes it is nice to be a little bit sick because it gives you an excuse to stay home and do nothing except what you feel like. I'm usually not super productive when I'm sick, but every once in a while it seems to help. I wrote my first pandaskunk story in 2012 over the course of a couple sick days and a weekend when I had the flu and was in some sort of delirious fever- or drug-induced state of heightened creativity.
--- Quote from: nicksgal on May 23, 2021, 12:20:31 AM ---I know, it's crazy! It was fun, but my dinner getting delivered derailed me; it's my fault for watching tv while eating.
My Saturdays have been less productive this month and my Sundays have been really productive, so I'm hoping that maybe that means tomorrow will be crazy productive if I already had a good Saturday.
--- End quote ---
Ugh, I do the same thing, and it usually derails me too. Last night I was going to try to get started on my next chapter, but I watched SNL and went to bed instead.
I'm with you on Saturdays vs. Sundays too. Of course I like Saturdays better, but Sundays have been more productive for me. Not so much today, but finishing a chapter is usually easier than starting a new one. I did start my Nick chapter and wrote 700 some words before I took a break... hoping to add some more this afternoon. I hope you're having a productive day!
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