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Author Topic: Writing & Thread (aka The Writing Thread 4)  (Read 94461 times)

nicksgal

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Re: Writing & Thread (aka The Writing Thread 4)
« Reply #75 on: June 24, 2021, 11:55:25 PM »

I hear you.  It is fun to feel like you have the flexibility to write whatever you want without flaking out on your other projects, but it's frustrating when you hop from story to story and nothing sticks.  So if PDemons is calling to you, go with it!

I'm glad you looked over Gobosei and found some places worth editing.  LOL I did the same thing with my two Nick cancer stories, gave the female character a C name.  That was not an intentional choice; I just thought those names fit best.

That was my thought too. I'd been steadily writing some scenes for it while writing PNecklace, so I knew the inspiration was still there. I guess my main thought was, if I'm back to write new things, then I'd rather have a variety of "this is my writing" type stuff to share. And yeah, epic fantasy is totally my wheelhouse (though it would be better if there were different ones and not just the same series if I'm leaning into this). But so are loving parodies, silly jokes, 90s style Boys bonding moments, and a whole plethora of other "dark" things that aren't epic fantasy. Of course I love PBox&Co, my magnum opus, my strongest character attachments, but I also like challenging myself. So now I know I can take a long hiatus, come back, and still write PBox-related stories. What else can I come back and write after so much time away?

Yeah, I think I needed to look at it with a critical eye and not just nostalgia for always being something I'd said I'd go back to. Poor Mariko, I picked her name before Minako, but... yeah. If Gobosei gets the edit it probably needs, it's already changing a lot, so I could stand to change several things about it including character names. LOL! Now that you mention it, you're totally right! Too funny.


I love this idea!  I think the AJ version works better for that scene because then the conversation wouldn't be totally one-sided like it would if Nick were sleeping in the background.  He can still participate, just in a distracted way as he's trying on hats.  I think you'd get more out of the joke that way.  You could have Nick pull a Howie and sleep through something important later in the story.  That said, I think it would be funnier with Howie as the love interest/chosen one because there just aren't that many Howie romances - fewer than AJ, I'm sure.  That, or Howie could be the one everything bad happens to.

Oh man, it gets even better. I spoiled almost nothing.  :biggrin: Yeah, I started thinking the same thing. For that particular joke, it would work better if the love triangle was with AJ. But for the subversion joke as a whole, Howie is clearly the better choice (and yeah, definitely fewer Howie romances than AJ romances). Seeing you write it just strengthens that thought, so thanks. :-*


I have wondered the same thing about their tour rehearsals.  I tried researching it once and wasn't able to find specifics for the Boys either, but it sounds like they would rent some sort of rehearsal space big enough to run through the whole show.  I found an article about Beyonce renting out a stadium in Tampa to rehearse for her tour a week before it started in Miami: https://www.tampabay.com/things-to-do/music/beyonc233-preps-for-her-formation-tour-with-rehearsals-in-tampa/2274355/  There also seem to be places that are specifically rehearsal studios, not actual concert venues.  Here's an article about those that names some specific ones in different cities: https://www.soundonsound.com/music-business/rise-large-scale-rehearsal-studio  I'm assuming these would be more affordable and practical than renting out an entire stadium.

I had an inkling that you, Tracy, or possibly Mare or Rose may have researched this at some point; glad my suspicions were correct. Thank you for those articles! I'll read over them. It's not totally a huge sticking point since it's really just a setting, but gotta love those details, right?

Here, a short gift, lol:

Damn! Nick licked his lips as he fiddled with the microphone stand, accidentally popping the mic out. It flipped and flopped in the air as he fumbled with it, but managed to catch it before it tumbled to the floor. He exhaled forcefully, clutching it tightly as he leaned against the empty stand, before snapping it back into place and leaning on it again. Nice save!

Through the hole under his arm, Howie, Brian, AJ, and Kevin were visible in the line beside him, poised with perfect professionalis m. Or, at least to the point where they weren't haphazardly attempting to destroy equipment. Kevin chugged his water bottle. AJ yawned and cleaned his sunglasses on his shirt, before fiddling with his watch, counting down the seconds, then minutes. Brian shot a free throw with his empty water bottle, clearly mouthing "nothing but net" when it hit the floor. Meanwhile, Howie winked at Nick, and mouthed… something to him.

Nick wrinkled his nose as he cocked his head. "What?"

It should have been a whisper. A regular voice would have been fine. Even his typically loud speaking voice would have been preferable. Unfortunately, when he'd fumbled with the mic, he'd accidentally turned it on. So the loud "what" blared and echoed across the silent [airplane hangar].
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~*Dee*~

People think it would be fun to be a bird because you could fly. But they forget the negative side, which is the preening.

From "And Now, Deep Thoughts" by Jack Handey

nicksgal

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Re: Writing & Thread (aka The Writing Thread 4)
« Reply #76 on: June 25, 2021, 12:08:11 AM »

LOL!  I don't think Nick has been killed by a lawn mower yet in 1000 Ways if you wanna add that idea to your list of things to write.

LOL! The next time I'm bored and haven't stabbed Nick in a while, I'll consider this.


LMAO Best scene in the entire movie!  Here it is if anyone else feels compelled to watch it now: https://youtu.be/09sBVx2jQ28?t=386  I do think he was a bit better in Dead 7, so at least he's improving?

Absolutely the best. I did want to watch it now, so thanks, lol. I also enjoy "There's a dead body here!"/"Forget that, man, I'm going back to the good side of the bridge." In general yes, but I was constantly distracted by his "this is what I think a gritty outlaw in a zombie western sounds like" accent, lol.


Same.  I seem to be most productive when I'm writing a scene that has a lot of dialogue and nothing I need to look up.  Those are the times where I can write for long periods of time without getting distracted and churn out 1,000+ words easily.  It's the scenes that are more descriptive or require research that I get the most distracted writing.

Dialogue is good or any action sequence I've planned for. The more I have to think, the slower it goes for sure. Description is fine depending on what it is, I try to keep resources I'd need for that close at hand (like I have a little tab group on my phone with body language based on feelings that I like to reference). Full research, well, you know. But at least I learn fun facts about horses and sand? lol
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~*Dee*~

People think it would be fun to be a bird because you could fly. But they forget the negative side, which is the preening.

From "And Now, Deep Thoughts" by Jack Handey

nicksgal

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Re: Writing & Thread (aka The Writing Thread 4)
« Reply #77 on: June 25, 2021, 12:16:49 AM »

I just realized in my catching up, I forgot to ask how everyone's writing was going now and not a few days ago. Oops! So how is everyone's writing going now?
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~*Dee*~

People think it would be fun to be a bird because you could fly. But they forget the negative side, which is the preening.

From "And Now, Deep Thoughts" by Jack Handey

RokofAges75

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Re: Writing & Thread (aka The Writing Thread 4)
« Reply #78 on: June 25, 2021, 12:26:47 AM »

I remember. Keep floating ideas. I'm always team sequel if the story warrants it or was always planned in multiple parts.

It's interesting that you've had so many sequel ideas you've wanted to explore. I think it's great to have so many stories worth continuing. :) LOL! Don't you love when everyone talks about something and then no one does it. So funny.

It's good that your novel projects have been going well. Don't stop on them to write a short story!

I have always liked the thought of writing sequels, but I used to be a little sequel-happy and then didn't finish most of them, so I told myself no more.  That was before BMS, which is my best exception to the rule.  I think I know myself well enough as a writer now that I would only attempt it if I felt like I had an idea worth writing that I would want to see through to the end, and I would only post it if it was going well.  With MBK, I think the basic premise is good, but it'll come down to whether or not I want to keep writing about this version of Kevin or do something different.


I'm not sure if that's because I've been interacting with y'all more and not in a writing bubble or because being in the fresh new beginning was more exciting than being in the middle or the end. Or that I'd only spent a month or so working on the same project fairly consistently instead of six months. If I don't sleep, I am a wreck, lol!

I think if you're on an extended vacation, it's both okay to have crazy writing days and slumps or spread it out so there's less slumps. Wherever your muse takes you, really.

LOL It's probably both.  Part of the reason I tend to be productive late at night is because there's no one around to talk to, so I don't spend as much time on this forum or Twitter.  But at the same time, the fanfic discussion around here is motivating and helps hold me accountable, especially during the school year when I'm tired and less likely to want to write.  I'm more likely to get on the computer if I think there are forum posts to catch up on and respond to (which is not so easy from my phone), and sometimes just getting on the computer is half the battle.  

Unless I'm on an end-of-story streak, I don't usually have multiple crazy writing days in a row, even in the summer.  I guess my brain needs a break.  I've been trying to read more and watch more movies to fill it with fresh ideas.


Yeah, when fiction ends up mirroring reality like that, it doubly gets me for sure from a fandom perspective. I'm sure the timing of it was quite surreal. I just cry at everything (even that stupid Budweiser commercial where the dog and horse reunite after several years), so it's weird that my writing doesn't make my cry as much. But then, I always trend toward dark over sad, so that might be part of it. Meanwhile, I will put any stupid joke in that pops in my head and laugh the whole time.

I'm the same way with crying about everything!  I was on my period last week too, so I was probably extra-emotional.  I found a great new YouTube channel called The Ambient Score that has nice long mixes of movie scores to use as writing music, and they have one for The Land Before Time.  I had tears in my eyes within the first few seconds of listening to that music!  I cry at commercials too.  The Budweiser ones kill me!  But I'm less likely to cry over my own writing, even when I'm writing something sad.


OMG! How did I miss this?! LMFAO! Howie! He totally deserved that! Also, I watched the whole thing and why are we still letting Nick say "conversate"? Nick... "conversate" is not a word...

I'm dying that Nick can't remember how old he was when they were recording IWITW. Nick, you were not 16. SOMH and QPG were probably right though.

LOL That was IAWLT promo.  Aww, Nick and his made-up big words.  Bless him.  I threw in a line where Kevin makes fun of the way he mispronounced "documentary" in my chapter the other day, and it made me laugh.

They are terrible at remembering dates, timelines, etc.  I guess it all blurs together over the years.
 They need us fans around to fact-check them on this sort of information LOL.


Just remember to find and replace the nicknames too! That's what will get you, lol. Unless they don't have any because it's an AU.

Could be fun to try if you ever get that itch. :)

Good advice!!  There probably aren't as many nicknames as I would normally use in a canon fic, but there may be some.  I would definitely reread the thing after using find/replace.  Luckily it's not a long one.

Yeah, if I ever really got the publishing itch, I think that would be a good place to start for the sake of getting my feet wet with the whole process because the initial work of writing a first draft is already done.  And because I already "published" it as a fanfic, it would be less devastating to get those inevitable rejection letters, because at the end of the day, I could just repost it as a fanfic.  It wouldn't feel like years of work wasted.  Though nowadays, there are so many other options besides traditional publishing for OF.  If you're not successful going that route, you can always self-publish.  I'm just kind of at a place in my life where I'm like, "What's the point?"  I don't like to share or talk about my writing with people in real life, and that's not just because it's BSB fanfic.  I don't think I would be any different with OF, so why on earth would I even want it published for the whole world to read?  I'm probably better off sticking to my little niche audience here on the internet.


So much more less wholesome! lol To be honest, it probably wouldn't have happened if I was flexible enough to do the splits, lmao!

LMAO!!
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~Julie

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RokofAges75

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Re: Writing & Thread (aka The Writing Thread 4)
« Reply #79 on: June 25, 2021, 01:06:50 AM »

That was my thought too. I'd been steadily writing some scenes for it while writing PNecklace, so I knew the inspiration was still there. I guess my main thought was, if I'm back to write new things, then I'd rather have a variety of "this is my writing" type stuff to share. And yeah, epic fantasy is totally my wheelhouse (though it would be better if there were different ones and not just the same series if I'm leaning into this). But so are loving parodies, silly jokes, 90s style Boys bonding moments, and a whole plethora of other "dark" things that aren't epic fantasy. Of course I love PBox&Co, my magnum opus, my strongest character attachments, but I also like challenging myself. So now I know I can take a long hiatus, come back, and still write PBox-related stories. What else can I come back and write after so much time away?

Yeah, I think I needed to look at it with a critical eye and not just nostalgia for always being something I'd said I'd go back to. Poor Mariko, I picked her name before Minako, but... yeah. If Gobosei gets the edit it probably needs, it's already changing a lot, so I could stand to change several things about it including character names. LOL! Now that you mention it, you're totally right! Too funny.

That's a good point.  And while I know we all write for ourselves first and foremost, you're more likely to attract new readers with something different and unrelated to PBox.  That's the problem with sequels - most people don't want to read a sequel without reading its predecessor(s), and if there's a lot to catch up on, they're probably less likely to do it than just start something brand new.  Especially on a site like AO3 that seems to favor one-shots.  For readers who are used to short stories, seeing all those chapters may be overwhelming.  That said, go with what you want to write most.  If that means finishing your magnum opus first, do it!  Then you'll be more free to focus on other things.  It is nice to know you can come back after so long and finish something!  It's inspiring to the rest of us who have long-unfinished stories too LOL.

Mariko, wow, that is similar!  I can see why your brain is substituting Minako LOL.  I think even if you changed it to another M name that does not end in "-ko," that would help.


Oh man, it gets even better. I spoiled almost nothing.  :biggrin: Yeah, I started thinking the same thing. For that particular joke, it would work better if the love triangle was with AJ. But for the subversion joke as a whole, Howie is clearly the better choice (and yeah, definitely fewer Howie romances than AJ romances). Seeing you write it just strengthens that thought, so thanks. :-*

You're welcome!


I had an inkling that you, Tracy, or possibly Mare or Rose may have researched this at some point; glad my suspicions were correct. Thank you for those articles! I'll read over them. It's not totally a huge sticking point since it's really just a setting, but gotta love those details, right?

Here, a short gift, lol:

Damn! Nick licked his lips as he fiddled with the microphone stand, accidentally popping the mic out. It flipped and flopped in the air as he fumbled with it, but managed to catch it before it tumbled to the floor. He exhaled forcefully, clutching it tightly as he leaned against the empty stand, before snapping it back into place and leaning on it again. Nice save!

Through the hole under his arm, Howie, Brian, AJ, and Kevin were visible in the line beside him, poised with perfect professionalis m. Or, at least to the point where they weren't haphazardly attempting to destroy equipment. Kevin chugged his water bottle. AJ yawned and cleaned his sunglasses on his shirt, before fiddling with his watch, counting down the seconds, then minutes. Brian shot a free throw with his empty water bottle, clearly mouthing "nothing but net" when it hit the floor. Meanwhile, Howie winked at Nick, and mouthed… something to him.

Nick wrinkled his nose as he cocked his head. "What?"

It should have been a whisper. A regular voice would have been fine. Even his typically loud speaking voice would have been preferable. Unfortunately, when he'd fumbled with the mic, he'd accidentally turned it on. So the loud "what" blared and echoed across the silent [airplane hangar].


LOL I love this!

Yeah, I know I looked it up for SAMS because there were scenes that took place during tour rehearsal.  I just kept it fairly vague and called the place a rehearsal venue.


Absolutely the best. I did want to watch it now, so thanks, lol. I also enjoy "There's a dead body here!"/"Forget that, man, I'm going back to the good side of the bridge." In general yes, but I was constantly distracted by his "this is what I think a gritty outlaw in a zombie western sounds like" accent, lol.

LOL So true.  His gritty outlaw voice wasn't nearly as funny as his gangsta voice in Kill Speed.  But Howie's constantly changing accent was!


Description is fine depending on what it is, I try to keep resources I'd need for that close at hand (like I have a little tab group on my phone with body language based on feelings that I like to reference). Full research, well, you know. But at least I learn fun facts about horses and sand? lol

That's a good idea!  Is the body language thing something you can share?  I'm curious to see it.  I feel like I use the same few descriptions for body language over and over again, so maybe there are some I haven't thought to include.

Very true!  I am always up for learning and don't consider it a focus fail if I'm actually researching something I need for the story.  My problem is I easily get sucked down rabbit holes.  Lately it's YouTube.  I've subscribed to several channels that have helpful content for my story, so I'll go to YouTube to look up something or open my writing music playlist and then see something shiny in the recommended videos section and click on something totally unrelated to what I'm supposed to be looking up.  This week it's been Titanic/Kate & Leo videos.  I watched one of those "Guy reacts to watching Titanic for the first time" last week, so now I get a ton of Titanic videos in my recommendation s... and the more I click on them, the more they tend to pop up.


I just realized in my catching up, I forgot to ask how everyone's writing was going now and not a few days ago. Oops! So how is everyone's writing going now?

Mine's been okay.  I've still been writing every day, just not as much as I would like (a.k.a. not enough to make my Nano goal).
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~Julie

"Sometimes writers and sociopaths are hard to tell apart." -J.K. Rowling

FrickingKaos

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Re: Writing & Thread (aka The Writing Thread 4)
« Reply #80 on: June 25, 2021, 05:19:16 AM »

Lol. I've been watching people watch movies for the first time on YouTube too. Get out of my brain. Haha.

Writing has been going really well which is surprising because nobody's reading Take Me Home. I haven't had any interest in it which does challenge me via having nobody motivating me to write. So I've fallen back on watching science fiction to get inspired, along with inspirational writing music I found on YouTube. I'd gone two days without writing, put on this one playlist and I cranked out a whole chapter in one sitting.

It's okay if nobody is reading, usually that makes me sad but I am so close to finishing this story that I don't want to abandon it which in turn motivates me instead of waiting for reviews. It's kind of freeing in a way.

But low key I hope someone does read eventually lol
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RokofAges75

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Re: Writing & Thread (aka The Writing Thread 4)
« Reply #81 on: June 25, 2021, 09:48:31 PM »

That's exciting that you're so close to finishing!  That is definitely motivation in itself, but I know it's frustrating when you're not getting feedback and you feel like no one's reading.  The same thing happened to me when I came back to Secrets of the Heart after 3+ years of barely updating it.  The few people who had shown an interest in it when I posted the beginning had disappeared, so I had to finish it for myself.  I'm sure the same thing would happen with Guilty Roads if I started working on that one again after so long.  It's disappointing, but the satisfaction of finishing a story will make up for the lack of feedback.  And it may just take time for people who didn't read it back when you first started posting it to discover it and get caught up, so give it time.

I'm glad you found some inspiration writing music on YouTube!  That's been my go-to for writing music lately too.  Do you have any recommendation s?  I'm always on the lookout for new writing music.  My current favorite channels for writing music are The Ambient Score (https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCBLnImOsHcvdI56RaRRmLzA) and Ambient Worlds (https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCfR8HhkbpDAwvYxrecNg4Mg).  The Ambient Worlds videos have beautiful changing backgrounds that are fun to put on for added ambience if I'm writing in front of the TV.  If you have Amazon Prime, Prime Music also has some good writing music.  I have a writing playlist there, but I also sometimes just listen to the movie scores station or stations for individual composers I like.
« Last Edit: June 25, 2021, 09:51:48 PM by RokofAges75 »
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RokofAges75

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Re: Writing & Thread (aka The Writing Thread 4)
« Reply #82 on: June 26, 2021, 04:44:34 AM »

Here is an example of why I write so slowly.  I wrote a sentence:  "That evening, while AJ went off to do his show, Kevin and I watched a movie."  I thought to myself, I should specify what movie they watched - not because it's important, per se, but just because it's nice to include those details that help bring the story to life.  So what movie should they watch?

It happens to be Easter Sunday in the story, so my first thought was that maybe "The Ten Commandments" would be on TV, as it usually is around Easter, and Kevin could make Nick sit through all four hours of that movie.  But because I feel compelled to fact-check what I can, I went to my historical TV listings site (http://www.tvtango.com/listings/) to see if it was actually on TV on Easter Sunday in 2008.  No, it aired the night before.  So I scratched that idea.

My next thought was to browse movies that came out in 2007 and would have been released to DVD in early 2008, thinking maybe they would watch a new movie.  A lot of pretty good movies came out that year, though none that stood out to me as an obvious choice.  Maybe "Knocked Up" because it's funny, and I feel like they would want to watch something light.  But how would they acquire said movie?  Streaming wasn't really a thing in 2008, was it?  A quick Google search confirmed that Netflix didn't start its streaming-only service until 2010.  Which means they would have had to rent a DVD, either through old-school DVD-by-mail Netflix or an even older-school video store.  (Are/were video stores in Hollywood open on Easter?  Most places are closed on Easter here, but I live in a predominantly Christian community, which I realize is not the case everywhere.)  Or I could forget the new movie and just have them pop in a DVD from home.  Or flip channels until they found a movie on TV.

But what movie?  Should it be something symbolic and relevant to the plot of my story or completely random?  I still haven't decided, so now it's a question of how long I will sit here and agonize over this small detail until I either make a decision and go with it or leave it at "We watched a movie" and move on.

Does anyone else do this when they write, or is this just me being anal? LOL


Update: I decided to leave it at "We watched a movie" and move on without specifying which one.  I ended up writing almost 1,400 more words and finishing my chapter, so I guess that was the right decision.  If I come up with a perfect movie later, I can always go back and add it in, but I don't think it's necessary.
« Last Edit: June 26, 2021, 08:10:57 AM by RokofAges75 »
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nicksgal

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Re: Writing & Thread (aka The Writing Thread 4)
« Reply #83 on: June 26, 2021, 02:12:34 PM »

I have always liked the thought of writing sequels, but I used to be a little sequel-happy and then didn't finish most of them, so I told myself no more.  That was before BMS, which is my best exception to the rule.  I think I know myself well enough as a writer now that I would only attempt it if I felt like I had an idea worth writing that I would want to see through to the end, and I would only post it if it was going well.  With MBK, I think the basic premise is good, but it'll come down to whether or not I want to keep writing about this version of Kevin or do something different.

I was the opposite. I didn't really think about sequels until that 2003 OF and Gobosei because they were originally planned as serializations (more like an ongoing storyline in a comic than a novel and sequels), so that's when I started thinking in terms of "there's a story, but that story is just one part inside what can be a bigger story." I blame my obsession with manga in high school for that; pretty much all the ones I read were multi-arc juggernauts rather than short collections. The rest of my Backstreet fanfic, or writing in general, wasn't like that though. Heck, even PBox wasn't originally meant to be in a series when I first envisioned it; yet, it became that probably around the time Nick refused death -- maybe because he was adamant that he had a story to tell beyond the scope of PBox, lol.

I think that's a fair stance to have. If the initial stories are the ones getting completed, but the sequels weren't, then I think I would also put the kibosh on sequels. There's a happy medium for it though. It seems like a lot of your ideas back then were "a little more than what was there, but maybe not enough for a whole novel." So something like your short SAMS one-shot is the perfect alternative. I think it's a good exercise for us novel writers. How can we convey a complete arc in a shorter medium? It's why I wished I'd taken on more of Mare's challenges back in the day; I just never had strong enough ideas for any of them. That could have been because they were the photo challenges back then, rather than the more broad "basic premise" ones though.

Do you hold a lot of your story ideas because you're not quite sure if you'll see them through to the end?


LOL It's probably both.  Part of the reason I tend to be productive late at night is because there's no one around to talk to, so I don't spend as much time on this forum or Twitter.  But at the same time, the fanfic discussion around here is motivating and helps hold me accountable, especially during the school year when I'm tired and less likely to want to write.  I'm more likely to get on the computer if I think there are forum posts to catch up on and respond to (which is not so easy from my phone), and sometimes just getting on the computer is half the battle.  

Unless I'm on an end-of-story streak, I don't usually have multiple crazy writing days in a row, even in the summer.  I guess my brain needs a break.  I've been trying to read more and watch more movies to fill it with fresh ideas.

Probably! Sorry for sleeping and not being a gremlin anymore, lol. Yes, I do enjoy all of us cheering each other on and talking about our writing. It's fun to discuss little specifics and discuss them from the broad "literary aspects" and also fun to talk about the broad things we all encounter without specifics. At the end of the day, we all have bouts of inspiration, struggles with writers block, write novel-length fiction (here anyway), and use the same main characters. So even if the details aren't the same, the overall experience is pretty similar. :) I think it helps mitigate some of the "reader silence" for me personally.

I agree, getting in front of a place to write is half of the struggle. That's why in the beginning of getting back into it, I worried less about word count and more about "writing any words." I think now it only bums me out if I feel like I'm writing a lot of words, but I'm actually not, lol. Those days are jarring. And yes, using my phone to post on the forum is really hard and more time consuming than the effort it takes to get on the computer.

I guess I don't either. Those two weekend of really high days were the last five chapters of PNecklace. I think my highest word-count day was my over 5,000 one in November, but I think the day afterward was average? I just looked it up, I lied. The next day, I wrote about 4,000 words. I guess if I have a really high day, the next day will usually be really high as well. If only I could aim to have only high word count days, lol. I'm guessing these are untamed bursts of inspiration rather than the day to day? I had these with PBox too, but back then it's when I would get the chapters done, rather than trying to put in even mediocre effort on a daily basis. I try to live by the "you can't edit a blank page" adage these days, but I don't know if I was in the right headspace back then to commit to daily (or near daily) writing. I do need to get back into doing some other things besides writing. There's many books and movies I've been meaning to give some attention to.


I'm the same way with crying about everything!  I was on my period last week too, so I was probably extra-emotional.  I found a great new YouTube channel called The Ambient Score that has nice long mixes of movie scores to use as writing music, and they have one for The Land Before Time.  I had tears in my eyes within the first few seconds of listening to that music!  I cry at commercials too.  The Budweiser ones kill me!  But I'm less likely to cry over my own writing, even when I'm writing something sad.

Been there. Hubs and I were watching Trevor Noah once and he was doing a segment where he talked about a teenager that made bowties for all the dogs at the local animal shelter for an event they had; I was sobbing because they looked so adorable and all ended up getting adopted -- hubs made so much fun of me. Ugh, don't get me started on TLBT! Littlefoot's mom dying... heartwrenching!

I wonder why we don't cry at our own writing? Outside of laughing, I can normally feel myself feeling slightly anxious when I'm writing about the characters being anxious/nervous/afraid/worried about something (like a tight feeling in my chest), but I don't cry or get angry or anything like that. Can't explain it.


LOL That was IAWLT promo.  Aww, Nick and his made-up big words.  Bless him.  I threw in a line where Kevin makes fun of the way he mispronounced "documentary" in my chapter the other day, and it made me laugh.

They are terrible at remembering dates, timelines, etc.  I guess it all blurs together over the years.
 They need us fans around to fact-check them on this sort of information LOL.

I asked it and remembered that right afterward, lol. I joke, but as a lover of linguistics, I actually do have a soft spot for his made up fancy words. I wish more new words were added to our lexicon. lol! Yes! I wrote another short bit of the "Nick avoids being the main character" story and definitely added "conversate" to a piece of Nick's dialogue because I was thinking about it, lol.

I know. I need to stop asking and judging them, lol. My real qualm was that he remembers that he turned 19 in 1999. He remembers that Millennium came out in 1999. He remembers that IWITW was the lead single from Millennium. Yet somehow he thinks that they recorded it when he was 16 when they would have been busy touring for the red album and recording Backstreet's Back (the album). If he had said 18, maybe even 17, I would have accepted it. They really do need us to keep their timelines straight, or the more meticulous among us. Sometimes I have a vague memory myself, lol.


Good advice!!  There probably aren't as many nicknames as I would normally use in a canon fic, but there may be some.  I would definitely reread the thing after using find/replace.  Luckily it's not a long one.

Yeah, if I ever really got the publishing itch, I think that would be a good place to start for the sake of getting my feet wet with the whole process because the initial work of writing a first draft is already done.  And because I already "published" it as a fanfic, it would be less devastating to get those inevitable rejection letters, because at the end of the day, I could just repost it as a fanfic.  It wouldn't feel like years of work wasted.  Though nowadays, there are so many other options besides traditional publishing for OF.  If you're not successful going that route, you can always self-publish.  I'm just kind of at a place in my life where I'm like, "What's the point?"  I don't like to share or talk about my writing with people in real life, and that's not just because it's BSB fanfic.  I don't think I would be any different with OF, so why on earth would I even want it published for the whole world to read?  I'm probably better off sticking to my little niche audience here on the internet.

That was one Mare mentioned to me. I think she said she fudged around it for the less specific ones like calling Howie "D" by giving Howie's character a name that started with D. Whereas keeping "B-Rok" or "Kev" or something would be a big giveaway. That is the nice thing about an AU, many of those more obvious things just aren't in there. Or at least a super divergent AU. Something like Gobosei is an AU, but only in the sense that it's "alternate universe where the Backstreet Project is real" and not "alternate universe where the Boys are all working at a Target together" or something more like Secrets of the Heart is (That's this one, right? I'm sorry, I have a hard time keeping track of all the stories you published while I was away, lol). It's thankfully one of the things that I also don't have to worry about in PBox&Co (for the most part), since the chapters where it does make a difference, I've basically decided that cutting them or hacking/slashing them is just the better option; that and keeping Nick's name the same means I can reasonably keep all my "Nick/Nickolas/Nicky" without many issues.

That's true, though I think it would depend on how much time you spent paring down the fanfic aspects on any work. I think it would still be hard to hear "this won't work as a published novel" after working on something for such a long time. Not sure though, haven't tried it. I think there's hard things with self-publishing too. First the whole "print on demand" aspect is a monetary pain. But probably more than that is having to be your own editor, publicist, marketer, sales, and so on. Of course it's possible to hire people to do those things, but then that further cuts into your bottom line and so on. Not that it's only about making money, but all those things are full time jobs, so if writing the book you're selling isn't paying the bills, adding more of a workload might also not increase the ability to pay bills. Having worked two full time jobs at one point (one of which I wasn't getting paid for, because you know, student teaching), I can attest to the difficulty of working a job for a passion, but still having to work something menial to pay rent. And there's just not enough hours in the day to do all of that and take care of yourself; I wouldn't do it again. That said, I think if anyone's already a popular fanfic writer, it would probably be an easier task to transition into self-publishing if you could convince your readership to go with you.

But I also agree that there's something nice about knowing your audience is out there in a medium your comfortable with them interacting with you. :) I've never minded discussing my writing with other people, I'm just abysmal at the elevator pitch. For anything; there's this leadership styles compass thing, and I'm firmly in the "feelings/details" camp of it -- "big picture" is okay, "just do it" is not. So I definitely get bogged down in the details of things.


LMAO!!

Yes, yes, laugh at my pain.  ;)
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~*Dee*~

People think it would be fun to be a bird because you could fly. But they forget the negative side, which is the preening.

From "And Now, Deep Thoughts" by Jack Handey

nicksgal

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Re: Writing & Thread (aka The Writing Thread 4)
« Reply #84 on: June 26, 2021, 03:54:33 PM »

That's a good point.  And while I know we all write for ourselves first and foremost, you're more likely to attract new readers with something different and unrelated to PBox.  That's the problem with sequels - most people don't want to read a sequel without reading its predecessor(s), and if there's a lot to catch up on, they're probably less likely to do it than just start something brand new.  Especially on a site like AO3 that seems to favor one-shots.  For readers who are used to short stories, seeing all those chapters may be overwhelming.  That said, go with what you want to write most.  If that means finishing your magnum opus first, do it!  Then you'll be more free to focus on other things.  It is nice to know you can come back after so long and finish something!  It's inspiring to the rest of us who have long-unfinished stories too LOL.

Exactly. If I'd gotten to the end of NaNo and hadn't thought about coming back to the fandom aspect, then I would have known that my heart was in it for PBox, which I think I'd even mentioned maybe trying to turn into an original story even way back when I was first writing it. But I came back to be back, so may as well write other things too and see who out there may enjoy them. And yes, that is definitely a danger with a series unless it's something like... oh, I don't know... Discworld... where the universe is the same, but the characters' stories are only connected on the broad scale of the universe's happenings (for the most part). Whereas something like PBox&Co (like Harry Potter, the Hunger Games, Twilight, whatever) does depend on a certain degree of knowledge on the prior books. Like could you imagine picking up The Deathly Hallows without having read any other Harry Potter books? lol It probably doesn't help that reading the entirety of PBox's story through the end of PDemons means committing to 150 chapters (probably... having not written the last one, I can't say for certain) that are all at least 3,000 words. That's... a lot of words. It's probably easier in a publish novel (or on AO3) since you can't see the word count for a chapter prior to reading it.

And yes, you're also correct that it's another ball game being a novel writer in an increasingly one-shot fan content platform. I think that's something we all face.

You know, at this moment, I can't picture a world where PBox Nick isn't popping around in my head somewhere. Even when I wasn't actively writing, there were still times that I would have dreams about PBox. Not concrete enough to write anything down afterward, but enough to think "huh, Pbox?" when I woke up. Being completely finished with it would be a bizarre feeling. I'm glad you feel inspired by my new-found work ethic. I will do my best to continue to be an inspiration! lol


Mariko, wow, that is similar!  I can see why your brain is substituting Minako LOL.  I think even if you changed it to another M name that does not end in "-ko," that would help.

Yeah... I guess I just really wanted to name my female protagonists with "M---ko" names back then, lol. But I also have "Madeline" in PNecklace (nothing to do with the song, I'd named her that before IAWLT had been released), so I think it's time to move on from M names.

There's several things in the backstory I think I'd like to change about Gobosei, so I think I can reasonably move away from "Asian influences" in it in general. I've gotten a lot of that desire out in PBox as a fanfic and honestly will probably move even further away from it in PBox as OF. In my general research on portraying POC I've been doing lately, I stumbled on a blog called "Writing With Color" and have been chewing on some of their "food for thought" type stuff in my current only vaguely WADDing state. Something they said really stuck with me, which was something like "fantasy [races], rather than drawing from real life cultures (unless it's already deeply entrenched in a real world culture), should be envisioned more as 'alien cultures,' something totally new." (I put "[races]" because while that's the trope name y'all would be more familiar with, they're very adamant over there on the difference between "race" and "culture," which I agree with.) And really, after spending time messing around on vulgar lang, it seems like a good next step. Like, four countries... of course they would have their own cultural elements rather than the vague sameness they have now even if all the characters we follow are all demons (who realistically fall more into "species" than "race"); even something as small as the differences between life in Iowa versus Georgia would be a difference in culture. This is neither here nor there, but something writing-related I've been thinking about this past week that I found interesting. :)


LOL I love this!

Yeah, I know I looked it up for SAMS because there were scenes that took place during tour rehearsal.  I just kept it fairly vague and called the place a rehearsal venue.

Yay! I think I'm on to something, lol.

That's probably what I might go with, since it's not a major setting or even the bulk of the story.

Here's my next toss out into fandom free-for-all opinions: So what is my plot for AJ? Is there one I'm forgetting that Nick would be more likely to be involved in than AJ would? I'm at a loss basically, lol. It's a good thing I moved Howie to the love triangle, because I think I would have even less ideas for him. Will someone just spitball some basic ideas at me, so I don't spoil some of my other plans by telling you all what I've already considered? In my head, this story is meant more as a novella (I think 25 chapters may be my limit on it -- Nick can only avoid being the main character for so long before he inevitably ends up in that role based on the premise as a whole, I think, lol), so bare bones is fine.


LOL So true.  His gritty outlaw voice wasn't nearly as funny as his gangsta voice in Kill Speed.  But Howie's constantly changing accent was!

It was not! He should really just stick with his regular voice. It would be less distracting, lol. I died at Howie's accent. I think the direction he got for it was very vague, so I feel like by the end, he was at the point where he was trying to be as ridiculous as possible to see if he would get called out on it. And obviously, Nick who has this penchant for unnecessary over-acting probably loved it at face value not realizing it was more of a joke, lol.


That's a good idea!  Is the body language thing something you can share?  I'm curious to see it.  I feel like I use the same few descriptions for body language over and over again, so maybe there are some I haven't thought to include.

It is! I'd love to share it! I stumbled on this website on accident when I was trying to get rid of the dialogue tags in PBox and was laughing at the ridiculous amount of "is angry, clenches fists" I had going, so I attempted to find other ways to show "is angry." The one I use most often in a quick pinch is "400+ Ways to Exploit Facial Expressions in Writing," but she has a whole bunch of different "other words for whatever" pages. I've been meaning to check out her Writer's Lexicon books, which is more of this type stuff, though she has helpfully put a lot of it online as a free reference, which is nice. I hope you find this useful too! :)


Very true!  I am always up for learning and don't consider it a focus fail if I'm actually researching something I need for the story.  My problem is I easily get sucked down rabbit holes.  Lately it's YouTube.  I've subscribed to several channels that have helpful content for my story, so I'll go to YouTube to look up something or open my writing music playlist and then see something shiny in the recommended videos section and click on something totally unrelated to what I'm supposed to be looking up.  This week it's been Titanic/Kate & Leo videos.  I watched one of those "Guy reacts to watching Titanic for the first time" last week, so now I get a ton of Titanic videos in my recommendation s... and the more I click on them, the more they tend to pop up.

LOL! I wish there was a way to turn off the "recommended videos" when you really just need to pop in for something quick. I also get sucked into YouTube rabbit holes when I'm just wanting one specific thing. :( Sometimes I love "react" videos and sometimes I hate them. I like the way "Kids React" has done it because they only show us snippets of the things they're reacting to and ask questions/have discussions about it afterward. Those parts are more fun than watching a live reaction to media, I think. Although, I do like CinemaSins.


Mine's been okay.  I've still been writing every day, just not as much as I would like (a.k.a. not enough to make my Nano goal).

That's the hard part in setting a goal. Even if you're writing consistently, it can feel stressing if you feel like you're not "writing enough." That's kind of how I felt in April, although, if I'd known I needed 80,000 words to finish and not 60,000 words, I probably would have been less stressed about not reaching my goal of finishing the last twenty chapters (and possibly would have thought more realistically about what I could finish in a month). That being said (I'm creeping), it looks like you've had a good writing day so far today and you only need about 2,000 words for each of the next few days to reach it. You're over halfway there already today! :) I believe!

Maybe I'll write more than 100 words today, lol. It's raining off and on, and I do like writing when it's raining.
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~*Dee*~

People think it would be fun to be a bird because you could fly. But they forget the negative side, which is the preening.

From "And Now, Deep Thoughts" by Jack Handey

nicksgal

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Re: Writing & Thread (aka The Writing Thread 4)
« Reply #85 on: June 26, 2021, 04:10:18 PM »

Lol. I've been watching people watch movies for the first time on YouTube too. Get out of my brain. Haha.

I love that y'all are on the same wavelength. Maybe I'll do this after writing a Nick&Kevin story, lol.


Writing has been going really well which is surprising because nobody's reading Take Me Home. I haven't had any interest in it which does challenge me via having nobody motivating me to write. So I've fallen back on watching science fiction to get inspired, along with inspirational writing music I found on YouTube. I'd gone two days without writing, put on this one playlist and I cranked out a whole chapter in one sitting.

It's okay if nobody is reading, usually that makes me sad but I am so close to finishing this story that I don't want to abandon it which in turn motivates me instead of waiting for reviews. It's kind of freeing in a way.

But low key I hope someone does read eventually lol

That's awesome that writing is going well and you're feeling inspired! And that you do feel like you're almost finished! :)

I've found that focusing on writing for myself and the story I want to tell has made me less worried about comparing or worrying about reader reactions. I do realize that we're coming from different places though. You've been here writing consistently and I've been a vague memory (if not completely forgotten), so I did come back knowing that I probably wasn't going to get a lot of people reading anything just from that (doubly so for coming back to write fantasy, triplely so for coming back to write a sequel). But, if you'd had people reading it when you were posting it originally and they're still reading, they'll make it back to it. :) I know I'd go back to any novel I'd started reading if it went on hiatus and came back while I was still around reading.

I can't say for sure whether internal or external motivation is... more motivating, I guess, but it is a great feeling knowing that you set out to do something for yourself/your story (and PBox Nick, though he's obviously not related to your writing on a personal level, lol) and finished. For me, it was probably a better feeling than "I did this and people liked it," because it was all on personal accomplishment . :) However, that being said, of course we're all publishing online to be seen, so I hope you will have readers following you through to the end. :) I think Julie's response is spot on too. :) It's there, so someone is bound to find it and enjoy it in time, even if they aren't there to motivate you along the way.
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~*Dee*~

People think it would be fun to be a bird because you could fly. But they forget the negative side, which is the preening.

From "And Now, Deep Thoughts" by Jack Handey

nicksgal

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Re: Writing & Thread (aka The Writing Thread 4)
« Reply #86 on: June 26, 2021, 04:54:07 PM »

Here is an example of why I write so slowly.  I wrote a sentence:  "That evening, while AJ went off to do his show, Kevin and I watched a movie."  I thought to myself, I should specify what movie they watched - not because it's important, per se, but just because it's nice to include those details that help bring the story to life.  So what movie should they watch?

It happens to be Easter Sunday in the story, so my first thought was that maybe "The Ten Commandments" would be on TV, as it usually is around Easter, and Kevin could make Nick sit through all four hours of that movie.  But because I feel compelled to fact-check what I can, I went to my historical TV listings site (http://www.tvtango.com/listings/) to see if it was actually on TV on Easter Sunday in 2008.  No, it aired the night before.  So I scratched that idea.

My next thought was to browse movies that came out in 2007 and would have been released to DVD in early 2008, thinking maybe they would watch a new movie.  A lot of pretty good movies came out that year, though none that stood out to me as an obvious choice.  Maybe "Knocked Up" because it's funny, and I feel like they would want to watch something light.  But how would they acquire said movie?  Streaming wasn't really a thing in 2008, was it?  A quick Google search confirmed that Netflix didn't start its streaming-only service until 2010.  Which means they would have had to rent a DVD, either through old-school DVD-by-mail Netflix or an even older-school video store.  (Are/were video stores in Hollywood open on Easter?  Most places are closed on Easter here, but I live in a predominantly Christian community, which I realize is not the case everywhere.)  Or I could forget the new movie and just have them pop in a DVD from home.  Or flip channels until they found a movie on TV.

But what movie?  Should it be something symbolic and relevant to the plot of my story or completely random?  I still haven't decided, so now it's a question of how long I will sit here and agonize over this small detail until I either make a decision and go with it or leave it at "We watched a movie" and move on.

Does anyone else do this when they write, or is this just me being anal? LOL


Update: I decided to leave it at "We watched a movie" and move on without specifying which one.  I ended up writing almost 1,400 more words and finishing my chapter, so I guess that was the right decision.  If I come up with a perfect movie later, I can always go back and add it in, but I don't think it's necessary.

First, I laughed so hard and loved your rabbit hole of attention to detail, down to seeing if it had been shown on Easter in 2008. I appreciate your meticulous research to have the right details even if your readers probably wouldn't look it up and chastise you for having them watch The Ten Commandments on Easter when it was shown the night before in 2008. You'd know, and that's what matters.

On the "what's open on Easter" thing, I will say that most major chains are open on Easter here (smaller stores, it's a toss up), so I feel confident saying they would be in LA as well. I've been in Georgia around Easter though, and that isn't the case. And then you have your Chik-Fil-As and In-N-Outs that will close on any "family holiday." So I would reasonably believe that they could have gone to Blockbuster (or sent someone to go for them).

I had a similar movie related stumbling issue recently. AJ was flipping around channels and stumbled on a movie to watch. Mine was a simpler query though as it was "what's AJ's favorite movie that existed before 2005 where it could be syndicated by then?" I didn't care about as many airing details. But I forced myself to write "[movie]" in place of a film title so I didn't get hung up on it, especially because "what movie" wasn't necessarily integral or even a major part of the scene. I've recently started doing that a lot knowing that I will get bogged down in these small details. I'll sometimes do it with bigger scenes I'm not fully prepared to write yet as well or when I know what happens next, but don't have time to write it at that exact moment. Like in "Nick avoids being the main character" the next thing I wrote after what I posted to you all was "[The other Boys are surprised, then laugh.]" You probably don't have to do the latter as much with you outlines, but I think there's something to be said for "[vague placeholder]" to try to stop the small detail agonizing. It's helped me stop to some extent, but I am still guilty of it. I'm sure you remember my "history of the backpack" rabbit hole, lol.

I'm glad you got so much more written and that being vague worked out! You're a champion today! Hopefully you'll keep writing more and more! (Hopefully I'll write something today too instead of just posting on the forum, lol. I'm writing really thoughtful replies today and also pausing halfway through all of them to do things with hubs/laundry -- we finally got our new washer/dryer installed last night! He just left the house, though, so I can write in peace.)
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~*Dee*~

People think it would be fun to be a bird because you could fly. But they forget the negative side, which is the preening.

From "And Now, Deep Thoughts" by Jack Handey

RokofAges75

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Re: Writing & Thread (aka The Writing Thread 4)
« Reply #87 on: June 26, 2021, 07:53:42 PM »

I was the opposite. I didn't really think about sequels until that 2003 OF and Gobosei because they were originally planned as serializations (more like an ongoing storyline in a comic than a novel and sequels), so that's when I started thinking in terms of "there's a story, but that story is just one part inside what can be a bigger story." I blame my obsession with manga in high school for that; pretty much all the ones I read were multi-arc juggernauts rather than short collections. The rest of my Backstreet fanfic, or writing in general, wasn't like that though. Heck, even PBox wasn't originally meant to be in a series when I first envisioned it; yet, it became that probably around the time Nick refused death -- maybe because he was adamant that he had a story to tell beyond the scope of PBox, lol.

I think that's a fair stance to have. If the initial stories are the ones getting completed, but the sequels weren't, then I think I would also put the kibosh on sequels. There's a happy medium for it though. It seems like a lot of your ideas back then were "a little more than what was there, but maybe not enough for a whole novel." So something like your short SAMS one-shot is the perfect alternative. I think it's a good exercise for us novel writers. How can we convey a complete arc in a shorter medium? It's why I wished I'd taken on more of Mare's challenges back in the day; I just never had strong enough ideas for any of them. That could have been because they were the photo challenges back then, rather than the more broad "basic premise" ones though.

I think it's natural for big ideas to evolve that way, starting as one story and eventually turning into more than one as the idea gets bigger and branches off in different directions.  I don't think any of my sequels were planned from the beginning either; they came about toward the end of or even after the first story, when I either realized I had another story arc for the same characters or thought, "That was fun.  I wanna write more stories like that!"  The ones that work best are the ones where there really is another story arc that seems like a logical progression of the overarching plot.  My failed sequels of the past were more along the lines of, "I got tired of writing the first story, so I decided to end it early and save the rest of the idea for a sequel I'll never actually write," or "I enjoyed writing this story about the Boys surviving a plane crash, so now I will write a sequel where they get shipwrecked!"  Lessons learned! LOL

I do think one-shots or short stories are a nice way to expand on a story without committing to another novel.  I wrote a little one-shot companion to Curtain Call after Nick's All American album came out because I was so inspired by a couple of the songs on it, and that was a fun way to revisit those characters.  I don't think anyone would want to read a novel-length sequel to that story or SAMS, nor would I want to write one.  And that's something to consider, too - not only whether or not I really want to write a sequel, but whether or not there's an audience for it.  If no one else is going to read it, then I have to weigh how much I really want to write it.  Is the idea worth spending that much time on when I could be devoting that time to writing something people will actually read?  Some ideas are, and some aren't.

I agree about the challenges.  I had a lot of fun with the few that I did, but I only did the ones I felt inspired to do.  I do think those few helped me broaden my horizons and experiment with different genres and writing styles, so there's definitely value in them.  It sounds like you have plenty of other story ideas to play around with, but if you ever get bored, you could always look back through the threads and pick out one to try.  The April Fool's challenges and the Fairy Tale Beauty and the Beast one were my favorites to do.


Do you hold a lot of your story ideas because you're not quite sure if you'll see them through to the end?

Yeah, I guess so.  I have a lot of ideas that made it as far as being written down, but never progressed to the point of having an outline or a first scene or anything.  I have other ideas that have a solid outline - as in, I have at least a general sense of the beginning, middle, and end - but I haven't tried writing them yet.  And then there are stories I've actually started writing and never posted because I stalled out on them before I hit that point where I felt they were going well enough to post.  Heroic Measures and MBK both started out that way, and I eventually came back to them, so there may be hope for a couple of those.  Guilty Roads was also an idea I'd had in one form or another for like 6-7 years before I finally started writing it, but that one did not turn out so well LOL.  I've had better luck jumping on fresh ideas and writing them right away than going back to old ones I've been holding on to for a while.



I agree, getting in front of a place to write is half of the struggle. That's why in the beginning of getting back into it, I worried less about word count and more about "writing any words." I think now it only bums me out if I feel like I'm writing a lot of words, but I'm actually not, lol. Those days are jarring. And yes, using my phone to post on the forum is really hard and more time consuming than the effort it takes to get on the computer.

I guess I don't either. Those two weekend of really high days were the last five chapters of PNecklace. I think my highest word-count day was my over 5,000 one in November, but I think the day afterward was average? I just looked it up, I lied. The next day, I wrote about 4,000 words. I guess if I have a really high day, the next day will usually be really high as well. If only I could aim to have only high word count days, lol. I'm guessing these are untamed bursts of inspiration rather than the day to day? I had these with PBox too, but back then it's when I would get the chapters done, rather than trying to put in even mediocre effort on a daily basis. I try to live by the "you can't edit a blank page" adage these days, but I don't know if I was in the right headspace back then to commit to daily (or near daily) writing. I do need to get back into doing some other things besides writing. There's many books and movies I've been meaning to give some attention to.

I agree, just making yourself open the story and write anything, even if it's just a word, is important when establishing that routine.  Once it becomes a routine, it's easier to write more than one word, but there are still days when I may only write one paragraph or even just a sentence.  Thankfully I haven't had many of those days this summer because I have more time and energy to make myself keep at it until I come up with more than that, but I still usually don't write as much as I feel like I should be for the amount of time I've been spending in front of the computer LOL.  I would have to write over 2,000 words a day these next few days to make my goal, which I am capable of, yet can't seem to do on this story.  It may just be the the nature of the story and where I'm at in it.  There aren't a lot of big, dramatic, pulse-pounding scenes, and those are the ones I get sucked into and write fast.  This one I'm just kind of strolling along through, slow and steady LOL.  But I'm making progress either way, so I guess that's what really matters.

I had really gotten away from reading for fun, so I'm trying to get back into that routine.  I have been plodding through "Where the Crawdads Sing" for about a year, so my first priority is to finish that book.  Everyone says it's so good.  It's not bad, but I get bored easily with it.  I'm about 3/4 of the way through, so I'm getting there!  I have a hard copy of that book, but I also took advantage of Prime Day and bought myself a new tablet to replace my broken Kindle Fire so I can read ebooks on a bigger screen than my phone.  That should help too.

I have been trying to do some other creative-type activities, too.  I finished building the Lego Knight Bus from Harry Potter that my niece and nephew got me for Christmas.  I hadn't played with Legos since I was a kid, so that was an experience!  I also started working on the BSB puzzle I bought during the pandemic and never put together LOL.  I hate doing puzzles, so I haven't gotten very far on it, but at least it's started.  I want to finish it and frame it so I can hang it up in my writing room.  And finally, I decided to redecorate my guest bathroom, which is the only room in my house I didn't do anything to after I bought it.  I decided it needs a fun theme.  I got the wild idea to give it a "The Shining" theme (so welcoming, right?) and went on Etsy to see if I could find any bathroom stuff to fit that theme, like a shower curtain or something... and OMG, I found so much stuff!!  The people of Etsy are just as warped as me LOL.  So I ordered a bunch of fun stuff that has slowly been coming in.  You have to be brave to spend the night at my house!


Been there. Hubs and I were watching Trevor Noah once and he was doing a segment where he talked about a teenager that made bowties for all the dogs at the local animal shelter for an event they had; I was sobbing because they looked so adorable and all ended up getting adopted -- hubs made so much fun of me. Ugh, don't get me started on TLBT! Littlefoot's mom dying... heartwrenching!

I wonder why we don't cry at our own writing? Outside of laughing, I can normally feel myself feeling slightly anxious when I'm writing about the characters being anxious/nervous/afraid/worried about something (like a tight feeling in my chest), but I don't cry or get angry or anything like that. Can't explain it.

Anything with animals is sure to get me, too!  Or those videos of military men and women coming home and surprising their families - I cry at every one of those, too.

That's a good question.  My first guess was that it's because we came up with the ideas and probably already envisioned the scenes beforehand, but that doesn't explain why we still cry watching sad movies we've seen a million times.  My other thought was that maybe it's because our brains are so focused on the process of writing that we're not feeling the emotions as much as if we were experiencing the story as a reader (or viewer of a movie).  I also get that anxious feeling when I'm writing dramatic/emotional scenes, but usually not to the point of crying or shouting at my screen or the kind of reactions I have when reading/watching other people's stuff.

But that brings up another question:  Have you ever cried while reading a scene you previously wrote?  I don't mean proofreading or editing, but just reading for the fun of it.  I have, but it's rare and not consistent.  There are certain scenes that actually will bring tears to my eyes sometimes, but not every time.  I think I'm more likely to cry if I've immersed myself in the story and read everything leading up to that point than if I just read a specific chapter in isolation.  And even then, it's usually just a certain line that will get me more than the entire scene.


I wrote another short bit of the "Nick avoids being the main character" story and definitely added "conversate" to a piece of Nick's dialogue because I was thinking about it, lol.

I know. I need to stop asking and judging them, lol. My real qualm was that he remembers that he turned 19 in 1999. He remembers that Millennium came out in 1999. He remembers that IWITW was the lead single from Millennium. Yet somehow he thinks that they recorded it when he was 16 when they would have been busy touring for the red album and recording Backstreet's Back (the album). If he had said 18, maybe even 17, I would have accepted it. They really do need us to keep their timelines straight, or the more meticulous among us. Sometimes I have a vague memory myself, lol.

Yay, I love that you used "conversate" in your story LOL.  It's fun to use those real life idiosyncrasies into stories when we can.  I make myself laugh every time I have Howie say "and stuff like that," which is not nearly often enough - but I guess if I overused that phrase, it wouldn't be funny anymore.

Yeah, unless IWITW was actually recorded much earlier than any of us thought LOL.  I guess we don't really know, but I also can't imagine him being younger than 18 when he recorded it.  He clearly was not thinking through all that logic.  And of the five of them, he should have the easiest time keeping track of dates and ages because of his birth year.  It's easy math to figure out how old you were in a given year when you were born in 1980 LOL.


That was one Mare mentioned to me. I think she said she fudged around it for the less specific ones like calling Howie "D" by giving Howie's character a name that started with D. Whereas keeping "B-Rok" or "Kev" or something would be a big giveaway. That is the nice thing about an AU, many of those more obvious things just aren't in there. Or at least a super divergent AU. Something like Gobosei is an AU, but only in the sense that it's "alternate universe where the Backstreet Project is real" and not "alternate universe where the Boys are all working at a Target together" or something more like Secrets of the Heart is (That's this one, right? I'm sorry, I have a hard time keeping track of all the stories you published while I was away, lol). It's thankfully one of the things that I also don't have to worry about in PBox&Co (for the most part), since the chapters where it does make a difference, I've basically decided that cutting them or hacking/slashing them is just the better option; that and keeping Nick's name the same means I can reasonably keep all my "Nick/Nickolas/Nicky" without many issues.

That's true, though I think it would depend on how much time you spent paring down the fanfic aspects on any work. I think it would still be hard to hear "this won't work as a published novel" after working on something for such a long time. Not sure though, haven't tried it. I think there's hard things with self-publishing too. First the whole "print on demand" aspect is a monetary pain. But probably more than that is having to be your own editor, publicist, marketer, sales, and so on. Of course it's possible to hire people to do those things, but then that further cuts into your bottom line and so on. Not that it's only about making money, but all those things are full time jobs, so if writing the book you're selling isn't paying the bills, adding more of a workload might also not increase the ability to pay bills. Having worked two full time jobs at one point (one of which I wasn't getting paid for, because you know, student teaching), I can attest to the difficulty of working a job for a passion, but still having to work something menial to pay rent. And there's just not enough hours in the day to do all of that and take care of yourself; I wouldn't do it again. That said, I think if anyone's already a popular fanfic writer, it would probably be an easier task to transition into self-publishing if you could convince your readership to go with you.

But I also agree that there's something nice about knowing your audience is out there in a medium your comfortable with them interacting with you. :) I've never minded discussing my writing with other people, I'm just abysmal at the elevator pitch. For anything; there's this leadership styles compass thing, and I'm firmly in the "feelings/details" camp of it -- "big picture" is okay, "just do it" is not. So I definitely get bogged down in the details of things.

Yeah, Secrets of the Heart is the AU one I'm talking about.  All five guys are in it, but they don't all know each other.  It's mainly about Brian and AJ, who don't know each other at the beginning but meet over the course of the story.  Kevin is still Brian's cousin, Howie is AJ's friend, and Nick is a substitute teacher who takes over for Brian when he's on leave.  So they don't have the same kind of brotherly/boyband relationship they do in real life where nicknames would get thrown around a lot.  I do think "D" is in there, so I would probably do the same thing Mare did and just give Howie a D name, but I'd have to look and see if there are any others.

I think it's fine to keep Nick's name the same.  Of all of them, that would be the one to keep (in a Nick-centered story, anyway).  When I started OF novelizing Broken, I also kept Nick's name and changed the other four.

Regarding publishing, those are all great points.  It's been years since I even half-seriously looked into it, but the more I read about the whole process, the less interested I am in pursuing it.  It does seem like it takes a lot of effort and/or money, depending on how you go about it, for little chance of success if you're going the traditional route.  Even if I succeeded, I don't know that the reward is worth the work and the risk in my case because, like I said, what would I even do with a published book?  I wouldn't want to promote it outside of the internet, and I probably wouldn't make much, if any, money from it, so what's the point?  I already have an internet presence and am fine with writing for free under a pen name, so the only point would be to prove that I'm good enough to published (which, in reality, I'm probably not LOL) and bask in the glow of seeing my book in print.
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~Julie

"Sometimes writers and sociopaths are hard to tell apart." -J.K. Rowling

RokofAges75

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Re: Writing & Thread (aka The Writing Thread 4)
« Reply #88 on: June 26, 2021, 08:20:52 PM »

There's several things in the backstory I think I'd like to change about Gobosei, so I think I can reasonably move away from "Asian influences" in it in general. I've gotten a lot of that desire out in PBox as a fanfic and honestly will probably move even further away from it in PBox as OF. In my general research on portraying POC I've been doing lately, I stumbled on a blog called "Writing With Color" and have been chewing on some of their "food for thought" type stuff in my current only vaguely WADDing state. Something they said really stuck with me, which was something like "fantasy [races], rather than drawing from real life cultures (unless it's already deeply entrenched in a real world culture), should be envisioned more as 'alien cultures,' something totally new." (I put "[races]" because while that's the trope name y'all would be more familiar with, they're very adamant over there on the difference between "race" and "culture," which I agree with.) And really, after spending time messing around on vulgar lang, it seems like a good next step. Like, four countries... of course they would have their own cultural elements rather than the vague sameness they have now even if all the characters we follow are all demons (who realistically fall more into "species" than "race"); even something as small as the differences between life in Iowa versus Georgia would be a difference in culture. This is neither here nor there, but something writing-related I've been thinking about this past week that I found interesting. :)

Oh wow... that is really interesting.  It's a great point.  If you imagine fantasy cultures as alien instead of drawing from a real culture, you're less likely to appropriate or write something that could be offensive.  And in this day and age, anything could be considered offensive.  It seems like a hard challenge to create four different fantasy cultures from scratch though.  Just another reason I will leave the fantasy writing to you! LOL


Here's my next toss out into fandom free-for-all opinions: So what is my plot for AJ? Is there one I'm forgetting that Nick would be more likely to be involved in than AJ would? I'm at a loss basically, lol. It's a good thing I moved Howie to the love triangle, because I think I would have even less ideas for him. Will someone just spitball some basic ideas at me, so I don't spoil some of my other plans by telling you all what I've already considered? In my head, this story is meant more as a novella (I think 25 chapters may be my limit on it -- Nick can only avoid being the main character for so long before he inevitably ends up in that role based on the premise as a whole, I think, lol), so bare bones is fine.

My first thoughts were getting kidnapped or getting a disease.  There are exceptions, of course, but usually those things don't seem to happen to AJ in stories, but they happen to poor Nick a lot LOL.


It was not! He should really just stick with his regular voice. It would be less distracting, lol. I died at Howie's accent. I think the direction he got for it was very vague, so I feel like by the end, he was at the point where he was trying to be as ridiculous as possible to see if he would get called out on it. And obviously, Nick who has this penchant for unnecessary over-acting probably loved it at face value not realizing it was more of a joke, lol.

LOL You're probably right.  I'm not sure Nick intended for the thing to be a campy SyFy movie in the beginning, but some of them clearly realized how ridiculous it was and had fun with it.  '90s boyband members fight zombies in the wild west... you can't beat that premise!  It's glorious LOL.


It is! I'd love to share it! I stumbled on this website on accident when I was trying to get rid of the dialogue tags in PBox and was laughing at the ridiculous amount of "is angry, clenches fists" I had going, so I attempted to find other ways to show "is angry." The one I use most often in a quick pinch is "400+ Ways to Exploit Facial Expressions in Writing," but she has a whole bunch of different "other words for whatever" pages. I've been meaning to check out her Writer's Lexicon books, which is more of this type stuff, though she has helpfully put a lot of it online as a free reference, which is nice. I hope you find this useful too! :)

Awesome, thanks!  Just bookmarked that to peruse later.


LOL! I wish there was a way to turn off the "recommended videos" when you really just need to pop in for something quick. I also get sucked into YouTube rabbit holes when I'm just wanting one specific thing. :( Sometimes I love "react" videos and sometimes I hate them. I like the way "Kids React" has done it because they only show us snippets of the things they're reacting to and ask questions/have discussions about it afterward. Those parts are more fun than watching a live reaction to media, I think. Although, I do like CinemaSins.

I think there might be, but let's be honest - I like watching those videos, or I wouldn't click on them.  And sometimes I do click on one related to whatever I was researching last time and learn something new, so they can be helpful, too.  Just distracting LOL.

I don't watch too many "react" videos, but I have a weakness for "Real doctors react to medical dramas" and anything related to Titanic.  Thankfully, the Titanic one I watched was edited down to about half an hour, and I still skipped through some of it.  I was just curious to see if the guy cried at the end because it was titled something like, "I Watched Titanic For the First Time and It DESTROYED Me!"  He did not, and I was disappointed. LOL  The "Kids React" videos are fun though!
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~Julie

"Sometimes writers and sociopaths are hard to tell apart." -J.K. Rowling

RokofAges75

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Re: Writing & Thread (aka The Writing Thread 4)
« Reply #89 on: June 26, 2021, 08:42:09 PM »

First, I laughed so hard and loved your rabbit hole of attention to detail, down to seeing if it had been shown on Easter in 2008. I appreciate your meticulous research to have the right details even if your readers probably wouldn't look it up and chastise you for having them watch The Ten Commandments on Easter when it was shown the night before in 2008. You'd know, and that's what matters.

On the "what's open on Easter" thing, I will say that most major chains are open on Easter here (smaller stores, it's a toss up), so I feel confident saying they would be in LA as well. I've been in Georgia around Easter though, and that isn't the case. And then you have your Chik-Fil-As and In-N-Outs that will close on any "family holiday." So I would reasonably believe that they could have gone to Blockbuster (or sent someone to go for them).

I had a similar movie related stumbling issue recently. AJ was flipping around channels and stumbled on a movie to watch. Mine was a simpler query though as it was "what's AJ's favorite movie that existed before 2005 where it could be syndicated by then?" I didn't care about as many airing details. But I forced myself to write "[movie]" in place of a film title so I didn't get hung up on it, especially because "what movie" wasn't necessarily integral or even a major part of the scene. I've recently started doing that a lot knowing that I will get bogged down in these small details. I'll sometimes do it with bigger scenes I'm not fully prepared to write yet as well or when I know what happens next, but don't have time to write it at that exact moment. Like in "Nick avoids being the main character" the next thing I wrote after what I posted to you all was "[The other Boys are surprised, then laugh.]" You probably don't have to do the latter as much with you outlines, but I think there's something to be said for "[vague placeholder]" to try to stop the small detail agonizing. It's helped me stop to some extent, but I am still guilty of it. I'm sure you remember my "history of the backpack" rabbit hole, lol.

I'm glad you got so much more written and that being vague worked out! You're a champion today! Hopefully you'll keep writing more and more! (Hopefully I'll write something today too instead of just posting on the forum, lol. I'm writing really thoughtful replies today and also pausing halfway through all of them to do things with hubs/laundry -- we finally got our new washer/dryer installed last night! He just left the house, though, so I can write in peace.)

LOL That is how meticulous I have gotten about fact-checking because you can find just about everything on the internet these days - so if I can find out for sure, I will.  I see it as a fun challenge of writing stories set in a specific time period, even if I waste time being meticulous with minor details that no one would ever fact-check me on.  But like you said, I would know, and that's what matters.

You're probably right about most places in L.A. being open on Easter.  I'm sure that's true of most big cities, other than maybe in the Bible Belt or deep South.

As far as AJ's favorite pre-2005 movie goes, this is where those old teenybopper Angelfire sites that list all their favorites from the 90s come in handy LOL.  I found several of them that say his favorite movie is Pulp Fiction, which would fit your criteria.  http://angels_bsb_love.tripod.com/ajbio.html  Here's a more recent article from 2015 where they list their favorite movies, and AJ says his all-time favorite is Dirty Rotten Scoundrels, which would also work since it's from 1988. https://editorial.rottentomatoes.com/article/the-backstreet-boys-five-favorite-films/

The placeholder is a good idea.  I hate doing it just because I'm one of those writers who edits as I go and aims for almost-final draft quality over a "sloppy copy."  But I do have a tendency to get bogged down on dumb, minor details like the movie thing or names for throwaway characters, so sometimes I have to make myself use [Name] if I can't make a quick decision.  This is why I name most of my minor doctor/nurse/therapist/cop characters after readers or people who have inspired me in some way; I keep a list I can refer back to when I need to pick a name so I don't have to make one up because I almost always overthink it.

I was super productive in the early a.m., but that was before I went to bed.  Now it's 8:30 p.m. and I haven't written anything since waking up LOL.  I have definitely switched from "morning" writing to "night" writing, even though most of it technically still takes place in the early morning.  But then it will count toward tomorrow's word count, not today's.  That is why I'm unlikely to hit 2,000 words, even today, because now I have to start a new chapter, and that's almost always slow going for me.

Yay for finally getting your new washer and dryer and some peace and quiet!  I hope you have a productive night!
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~Julie

"Sometimes writers and sociopaths are hard to tell apart." -J.K. Rowling
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