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[nicksgal]

So some writing questions for today! We've kind of discussed aspects of them, but I thought it would be fun to hear about everyone's process! I promise ahead of time that this is not meant to be a shameless plug, I just figured it would be easier to quote myself than rewrite it.

Over in my updates thread, I've been taking some time to post that there's updates (which, if you lived through any of my hiatuses when I was actually writing things, woah, consistent updates!), but also doing some "fireside chat" type things that are basically this thread, but PBox/PNecklace specific background info and thoughts that pop into my head as I edit/write. This week, I posted a small novel about the writing and planning process (please find some excerpts below as it very specifically focused on one tiny aspect of world building, rather than details on my overall process):

I have a novel about my novel entitled "Demon Powers and Plantsing" below (linked above). Enjoy!

An excerpt: Pantsing is more fun, but I've found the more epic you're envisioning a story, especially if it has complicated non-real world elements (like magic), the more you have to plan and world build. Like any weird and minute detail in the world, you'd better have an answer. Go ahead, in the replies, ask me anything and if it's not likely to be a spoiler, I'll answer it. I consider this space half an update thread and half an intimate fireside chat with your gal anyway, so interact with me as much as you want.

A second excerpt: If you haven't yet noticed, if I take the time to doodle something for a story, it has my full investment.

So the planning questions are as follows:

1. When an idea strikes, what's the first thing you do?

2. Are there any things you consider integral to your planning process? For example, Julie mentioned earlier in the thread that she often makes a banner when she's in the planning stages.

3. If you use outlines, how faithful are you to outlines? How detailed are your outlines? If you write first and plan later, how do you keep track of your ideas? Anyone go between the two?

4. What's the easiest part of planning? The hardest?

5. How far into the planning process do you know that an idea is definitely something you'll finish writing? Or the opposite, when can you tell if it should be scrapped?

6. Are there any clear signs to you that you're fully invested in an idea, either early or late?

7. Do you have a specific point where you decide you'll post something or do you just post everything you write?

Feel free to add others, but these are the questions I thought of off the top of my head!

[RokofAges75]

First of all, kudos to you for the time and effort you put into world-building.  As someone who mostly writes realistic fiction, that is not something I have much experience with, and it sounds daunting.

I love the process questions!

1. When an idea strikes, what's the first thing you do?
I think about it until it's coherent enough to write down.  Then I start an outline, which is usually just a Google Doc with a synopsis of the idea in the beginning.  Putting it into words helps me make sure it makes sense and I'll remember it later, since I sometimes sit on ideas for years before starting to write them.

2. Are there any things you consider integral to your planning process? Julie mentioned earlier in the thread that she always makes a banner when she's in the planning stages.
I have to have at least an acceptable working title before I can start writing the story.  If any of the important characters are original, I have to know their names and some basic information about them.  I don't always make a banner, but sometimes it does help motivate me.

3. If you use outlines, how faithful are you to outlines? How detailed are your outlines? If you write first and plan later, how do you keep track of your ideas? Anyone go between the two?
I am pretty faithful to sticking to the general plot I've planned out, but the specifics of how to get from Point A to Point B to Point C sometimes change.  How detailed my outlines are depend on how complicated the plot is and how much research is required.  My most detailed outlines have been for medical dramas and stories with multiple intertwining storylines to keep track of.  In those types of stories, my outlines tend to take on the form of timelines with events tied to specific dates, whereas a story like the one I'm writing now (Bethlehem) is more just a sequence of events written in order.

4. What's the easiest part of planning? The hardest?
My ideas tend to be plot-driven, so I think the hardest part for me is figuring out the characters' motivation for acting in certain ways.  Why would he/she do this?  How can I get them to this point?  Or, on the flip side, if I already have certain characters in mind (like, I want to write a bromantic A-Rok story), creating a plot for those characters.  (What will happen in my bromantic A-Rok story?)  I also seem to spend a lot of time thinking about titles and character names.  Oddly enough, I think the easier part or the part I enjoy the most is researching, as I figure out the setting and fill in details of the plot.

5. How far into the planning process do you know that an idea is definitely something you'll finish writing? Or the opposite, when can you tell if it should be scrapped?
I don't know until I start writing it.  Even then, there have been stories I've started that went well in the beginning, and then I hit a wall with them.  If I can get about a third of the way through and it's going well, then I'm pretty confident I'll finish it.  Up until that point, who knows.  I don't usually scrap ideas unless I realize the premise is flawed and unfixable, or I get a similar but better idea.  Otherwise they just stay in my idea folder for future reference because I never know when I'll get a burst of inspiration and come back to them.

6. Are there any clear signs to you that you're fully invested in an idea, either early or late?
I know I'm invested when I can't stop thinking about the story and when I care about the characters and what happens to them.

7. Do you have a specific point where you decide you'll post something or do you just post everything you write?
These days I typically wait till I have around 10 chapters written to start posting.  By that point in the story, I have a better sense of how it's going and how likely I am to continue it.  It also allows me to post a chapter a week and stay far enough ahead that I'm not as likely to catch up to myself and run out of chapters to post.

[nicksgal]

First of all, kudos to you for the time and effort you put into world-building.  As someone who mostly writes realistic fiction, that is not something I have much experience with, and it sounds daunting.

I love the process questions!

Some of it's really fun and some of it's pretty bleh. It's definitely time consuming. I always have trouble with maps and building layouts, so I wish I knew autocad or something like that, because I think being able to virtually poke at it in 3D would help me more than staring at squiggles on a piece of paper. There's a tiny bit of world building involved in realistic fiction, but it's more scrutinizing google maps for your settings (there are no beaches in Orlando, for instance) or making sure something can happen realistically in your story, like how long does it take Nick to get to Kevin's house in LA if he's laying on the couch in his house in Vegas when they discuss it? (it's not five minutes). I hope no one does those two things anymore, ha.

I thought you might! After posting my diatribe, I figured that maybe everyone else would enjoy a deep dive of their own!

1. When an idea strikes, what's the first thing you do?
I think about it until it's coherent enough to write down.

since I sometimes sit on ideas for years before starting to write them.

If an idea is not coherent enough to write down yet, how do you keep track of it? Do you have a mental list or do you have a physical document called "my writing ideas" or equivalent? Does every idea you have get to the outline stage?

2. Are there any things you consider integral to your planning process? Julie mentioned earlier in the thread that she always makes a banner when she's in the planning stages.
I don't always make a banner, but sometimes it does help motivate me.

You know I love hyperbole. I switched "always" to "often" in the original post.

4. What's the easiest part of planning? The hardest?
My ideas tend to be plot-driven, so I think the hardest part for me is figuring out the characters' motivation for acting in certain ways.  Why would he/she do this?  How can I get them to this point?

Oddly enough, I think the easier part or the part I enjoy the most is researching, as I figure out the setting and fill in details of the plot.

Throw things at them until they break? Do you have any sort of planning notes that help keep track of characters and their motivations throughout a story?

I have a question I have been dying to ask (but it seemed oddly specific in a general "questions thread) ever since I had to find the word "sternoclavicul ar" to really explain the size and placement of something. Medical research, how daunting is that? Do you look for accredited sources? How do you keep track of it all? Do you have this ever expanding document of medical jargon? Are youtube videos helpful? Do you get first person accounts? Write a novel about this for me, basically, because I'm intrigued.

5. How far into the planning process do you know that an idea is definitely something you'll finish writing? Or the opposite, when can you tell if it should be scrapped?
I don't know until I start writing it.  Even then, there have been stories I've started that went well in the beginning, and then I hit a wall with them.  If I can get about a third of the way through and it's going well, then I'm pretty confident I'll finish it.

Otherwise they just stay in my idea folder for future reference because I never know when I'll get a burst of inspiration and come back to them.

Have you ever posted a story that you didn't finish? Not recently with your backlog of course, but in the past? I'm notorious for it, but I was wracking my brain trying to think of one for you and can't.

How often do those bursts of inspiration happen?

[nicksgal]

I like to write mine after someone else answers because I am selfish and want to read what other people have to say more than I want to talk about my ideas, haha. Also it was really time for me to go to bed last night, but this was in my brain after my update process.

1. When an idea strikes, what's the first thing you do?

I usually make a list of major questions I have about the idea (e.g. "Why x?" "What happens if z?" "Why is Character B w?") and ideas on the overall theme. After that, I decide what types of characters need to be in the story, what their motivations might be, and how those motivations might change over time. Then I probably just start writing. In the past I would try to start at the beginning, but just writing what's interesting has actually been pretty helpful to me, because then I get to the heart of why I like the idea right away and then I can figure out how to build to the point earlier on than if I started writing from chapter one, page one, paragraph one, word one.

2. Are there any things you consider integral to your planning process? For example, Julie mentioned earlier in the thread that she often makes a banner when she's in the planning stages.

Characters and character arcs. I usually care more about the characters than the plot anyway, so I figure if they're solid, they can move the plot along pretty effortlessly on my part. Since I like to start writing and then plan along the way, I guess world building typically becomes integral to me (since it's a big part of my niche in fantasy land), but in the beginning, it's never really about that. I do have documents that talk about details like topography, timelines, legends, likely aspects of language, etcetera. Though I'm not full on Tolkien over here making up languages. I'm 100% Team "English for Your Convenience and Mine."

3. If you use outlines, how faithful are you to outlines? How detailed are your outlines? If you write first and plan later, how do you keep track of your ideas? Anyone go between the two?

I'm the worst at outlines. I don't like to use them, probably because mine are never very detailed. I think I said it once, but Kevin's first fighting chapter in PBox was definitely "Kevin's healing power is awesome as an attack. There are plants." and I only had that after I decided that Howie, Kevin, and AJ were each going to get a chapter to show off their skills. Which is... not much of an outline? The last chapter I left on for PNecklace literally has a comment on the Chapter marker that says: "X and Z hang out. Z and B have an important conversation about _____." And I only have that because part of it's already written and these scenes almost ended up in the previous chapter until what happened in the previous chapter was more interesting for longer than I thought it would take to tell that part. I definitely have pages of notes in google keep where I scribble down random things I think of, but it's only coherent for me. I think everyone else would look at it and wonder why I felt the need to write that down. Half of them read like me spitballing to myself, complete with things like "Omg, what if Nick forgot about their secret santa exchange, that would be hilarious!" or "(Hahaha, remember Sam Goody? So funny.)" It's like collaborating on the forum, but with myself.

4. What's the easiest part of planning? The hardest?

I like writing more than planning, but even if you take a "write first, plan later" approach, you still have to plan at some point as the story grows. I think characters are the easiest just because they're the part of a story I enjoy the most. If a story has a mediocre plot, but awesome characters, I can still usually get behind it. If the characters are only okay, the plot has to be really amazing for me. If they're both kind of crummy, I might hate read it while drinking haterade depending on who forced me to do so or how far I've gotten into a story when I realize it's not getting any better. The hardest is probably world building, but it can also be fun too. I love falling into a research time suck because I just love learning more about things I enjoy or learning new things. I guess, getting out of those time sucks might be the hardest part for me. That and knowing that anything I world build, I always know more than my readers, so anyone reading my stuff could see a snippet of something, but I have this whole other aspect of it that I have to plan and research and finalize because there can't be any plot holes. It's... a lot... but fun!

5. How far into the planning process do you know that an idea is definitely something you'll finish writing? Or the opposite, when can you tell if it should be scrapped?

In the past, I was pretty notorious for posting any old thing I wrote down, so I guess I never really know. It gets scrapped when I stop writing it? I think if I can clearly visualize the end, that's a point in its favor to get finished. This is the curse of pantsing, I suppose, I don't always know the end when I start writing. I usually get an end down by... chapter twenty? That sounds about right.

6. Are there any clear signs to you that you're fully invested in an idea, either early or late?

I've mentioned many times, including in the novel about my novel and the initial question post, that I'm a doodler. If I doodle a character, I will finish that story eventually. Like I have pages of old class notes where I doodled tiny, persistent PBox Nick. If I'm thinking about it enough to doodle it, it's basically permeated my brain. Hence why I can come back after a long hiatus and write a sequel.

7. Do you have a specific point where you decide you'll post something or do you just post everything you write?

I used to just post everything I ever wrote, but I think my plan from now on is that I need to be about 15-20 chapters ahead of the update because I think that will hold me more accountable and allow me to post more consistently than I had in the past.

[RokofAges75]

Some of it's really fun and some of it's pretty bleh. It's definitely time consuming. I always have trouble with maps and building layouts, so I wish I knew autocad or something like that, because I think being able to virtually poke at it in 3D would help me more than staring at squiggles on a piece of paper. There's a tiny bit of world building involved in realistic fiction, but it's more scrutinizing google maps for your settings (there are no beaches in Orlando, for instance) or making sure something can happen realistically in your story, like how long does it take Nick to get to Kevin's house in LA if he's laying on the couch in his house in Vegas when they discuss it? (it's not five minutes). I hope no one does those two things anymore, ha.

Yes, absolutely, but looking something up is a lot different from making something up.  Making it up requires much more creativity.  I can see where making a map would be helpful.  I still have a printed map of MacDill Air Force Base shoved in a drawer from when we were writing Undead; I referred to that a lot.

LOL I can forgive teenyboppers for their ignorance back in the day, but now that here are so many resources at our fingertips to quickly fact check something, there's no excuse for making those mistakes except being too lazy to look it up.

If an idea is not coherent enough to write down yet, how do you keep track of it? Do you have a mental list or do you have a physical document called "my writing ideas" or equivalent? Does every idea you have get to the outline stage?

It just kinda lives in my head until it becomes a fully formed idea or goes away, I guess LOL.  The other day when Nick was tweeting about signing up for some biomedical/genetics symposium, I jokingly tweeted, "I feel like I should write a fanfic about Nick going to med school" because he always shows such enthusiasm and interest in medical innovations.  And then I thought, "Hey, there could actually be a story idea in that."  But that's about as far as it went, so I didn't write anything down there.  If I have enough to write more than a sentence about an idea, I'll start a doc for it, which eventually turns into an outline if it sounds like something I would actually be interested in writing.  I have a folder for them on Google Drive.

Do you have any sort of planning notes that help keep track of characters and their motivations throughout a story?

I kinda just work it into my outline, usually in the synopsis, if the motivation seems complex enough that I need to keep track of it.  "Brian is feeling this way, so he does such and such because..."  Otherwise I just think about it until it's clear in my head.  With that kind of stuff, it's a lot like lesson planning - I can take time to write it all down, but once I do, I don't usually look at it when it's time to apply it because it's in my head.  But writing it down does come in handy for those times when I step away from an idea and come back to it after months or years and need a reminder of what I was thinking LOL.

I have a question I have been dying to ask (but it seemed oddly specific in a general "questions thread) ever since I had to find the word "sternoclavicul ar" to really explain the size and placement of something. Medical research, how daunting is that? Do you look for accredited sources? How do you keep track of it all? Do you have this ever expanding document of medical jargon? Are youtube videos helpful? Do you get first person accounts? Write a novel about this for me, basically, because I'm intrigued.

I actually love doing medical research.  I find it interesting, and it's a fun challenge to see how in-depth I can get and how much medical jargon I can decipher LOL.  My favorite website for that is Medscape (emedicine.meds cape.com) because it's catered toward professionals and has really detailed information on just about any condition, procedure, drug, etc.  I have to google words to fully comprehend it sometimes, but it has helped me out a lot over the years.  I also end up reading a lot of studies from medical journals.  YouTube videos are also helpful for describing procedures or getting personal accounts.  I've used blogs for the personal experience piece too.  I keep track of it all with bookmarks.  I have subfolders upon subfolders of bookmarks, divided by story and topic within that story.  Sometimes I take notes or copy/paste info into my outlines too.

I found a really cool tool not too long ago that lets you view 3D, interactive anatomy of the entire human body.  You can zoom in, peel back layers, rotate the body in any direction, etc.  If you ever need to get a better understanding of anatomy for the purpose of writing an injury or something, it could come in handy.  It's also just cool to play with if you like that kind of stuff.  https://www.biodigital.com/  You have to click on Individuals and then use your Google account, but it's free.

Have you ever posted a story that you didn't finish? Not recently with your backlog of course, but in the past? I'm notorious for it, but I was wracking my brain trying to think of one for you and can't.

How often do those bursts of inspiration happen?

Yeah, I have a few unfinished ones.  In the last ten years, there have only been two - a Nick/Kevin suspense/drama called Guilty Roads and a BSB/Harry Potter crossover called Harry Potter and the Half-Blood Backstreet Boy.  Guilty Roads started out strong, and then I got derailed about a month into it by another story idea that demanded to be written (Curtain Call) and never quite got back into my groove.  I haven't completely given up on it yet, but it's been years since I've actually written anything for it either.  The Harry Potter story was more of a side project, and then Cursed Child kinda ruined it for me.

I don't usually get bursts of inspiration for other stories when I'm in the process of working on one, unless it's a brand new idea, but I try to keep several ideas on hand so I have some options already outlined when I finish a story.  Half the time I end up getting a new idea and don't write any of the old ones, but having too many ideas is better than not having any.

[RokofAges75]

In the past I would try to start at the beginning, but just writing what's interesting has actually been pretty helpful to me, because then I get to the heart of why I like the idea right away and then I can figure out how to build to the point earlier on than if I started writing from chapter one, page one, paragraph one, word one.

That is a cool idea to write the middle first and then build back up to that point.  Do you ever have a hard time going back and writing the beginning, which may not be as interesting as the heart of the story?

I'm the worst at outlines. I don't like to use them, probably because mine are never very detailed. I think I said it once, but Kevin's first fighting chapter in PBox was definitely "Kevin's healing power is awesome as an attack. There are plants." and I only had that after I decided that Howie, Kevin, and AJ were each going to get a chapter to show off their skills. Which is... not much of an outline? The last chapter I left on for PNecklace literally has a comment on the Chapter marker that says: "X and Z hang out. Z and B have an important conversation about _____." And I only have that because part of it's already written and these scenes almost ended up in the previous chapter until what happened in the previous chapter was more interesting for longer than I thought it would take to tell that part. I definitely have pages of notes in google keep where I scribble down random things I think of, but it's only coherent for me. I think everyone else would look at it and wonder why I felt the need to write that down. Half of them read like me spitballing to myself, complete with things like "Omg, what if Nick forgot about their secret santa exchange, that would be hilarious!" or "(Hahaha, remember Sam Goody? So funny.)" It's like collaborating on the forum, but with myself.

There's no right or wrong way to do an outline.  It can be whatever you make it.  Mine all look different depending on what I feel I need to write down for the story.  Some of mine have definitely sounded like yours with lots of questions and ideas that aren't set in stone yet ("What if this happened?"), and I have put little jokes in for myself too LOL.  When I was writing Broken and BMS way back in the day, I had little notebook I kept in my nightstand and would jot barely legible notes in it, sometimes when I was half asleep.  No one else would be able to decipher most of it, but it made sense to me.

[nicksgal]

Yes, absolutely, but looking something up is a lot different from making something up.  Making it up requires much more creativity.  I can see where making a map would be helpful.  I still have a printed map of MacDill Air Force Base shoved in a drawer from when we were writing Undead; I referred to that a lot.

LOL I can forgive teenyboppers for their ignorance back in the day, but now that there are so many resources at our fingertips to quickly fact check something, there's no excuse for making those mistakes except being too lazy to look it up.

I've been there! It's pretty base-ic? (I'll see myself out...)

I'm just trying to catch up on the state of BSB fanfic basically. It seems unlikely that these things are still going on because time... but figured it was worth it to check.

It just kinda lives in my head until it becomes a fully formed idea or goes away, I guess LOL.  The other day when Nick was tweeting about signing up for some biomedical/genetics symposium, I jokingly tweeted, "I feel like I should write a fanfic about Nick going to med school" because he always shows such enthusiasm and interest in medical innovations.  And then I thought, "Hey, there could actually be a story idea in that."  But that's about as far as it went, so I didn't write anything down there.  If I have enough to write more than a sentence about an idea, I'll start a doc for it, which eventually turns into an outline if it sounds like something I would actually be interested in writing.  I have a folder for them on Google Drive.

How often do they "just go away?"

What a nerd, signing up for a symposium, just kidding! I am also a nerd who loves symposiums. See, and my first thought to you quoting this was "Please call it 'Dougie! Carter, MD'." (I will see myself out again.)

How many docs are in the folder right now?

With that kind of stuff, it's a lot like lesson planning - I can take time to write it all down, but once I do, I don't usually look at it when it's time to apply it because it's in my head.  But writing it down does come in handy for those times when I step away from an idea and come back to it after months or years and need a reminder of what I was thinking LOL.

Off topic, but that's why I hate writing down lesson plans when I actually have to do it, because them being "in there" is good enough for me to execute.

How long does it typically take you to go back to an idea? I feel like PNecklace has in some form been jumbled in my head for the past decade, but I'm doing it now like that author who writes a chapter, deletes, and then rewrites from memory because I have long ago lost any written record of what it was early on post-PBox. I'm so appreciative of the Google suite.

I actually love doing medical research.  I find it interesting, and it's a fun challenge to see how in-depth I can get and how much medical jargon I can decipher LOL.

I found a really cool tool not too long ago that lets you view 3D, interactive anatomy of the entire human body.  You can zoom in, peel back layers, rotate the body in any direction, etc.  If you ever need to get a better understanding of anatomy for the purpose of writing an injury or something, it could come in handy.  It's also just cool to play with if you like that kind of stuff.

I knew you did! Which was why I wanted to learn more about your experience with it and what you do with it once you've gotten what you need. How much of that medical jargon and in-depth research ends up in your works? Or is it like your version of world building where you know twice as much to avoid plot holes.

That sounds fascinating and I will definitely check it out, but I for sure gagged at it being described as "peel back layers," though I'm sure that's exactly what it is.

Yeah, I have a few unfinished ones.  In the last ten years, there have only been two - a Nick/Kevin suspense/drama called Guilty Roads and a BSB/Harry Potter crossover called Harry Potter and the Half-Blood Backstreet Boy.

I don't usually get bursts of inspiration for other stories when I'm in the process of working on one, unless it's a brand new idea, but I try to keep several ideas on hand so I have some options already outlined when I finish a story.  Half the time I end up getting a new idea and don't write any of the old ones, but having too many ideas is better than not having any.

Those demanding stories are the worst, so pushy. I hope you are eventually able to get back to Guilty Roads. Did you ever write HP fanfic outside of that crossover? I'm not very versed in HP (which seems odd given all this), but can you just tell me what houses the Boys were in? I'm just curious if we have similar opinions.

Do any of your current options feel like "What's next after Bethelehem"? Or do you feel like a new idea will strike?

[nicksgal]

That is a cool idea to write the middle first and then build back up to that point.  Do you ever have a hard time going back and writing the beginning, which may not be as interesting as the heart of the story?

Being away from writing so long, I just decided that rather than waiting to write the parts I wanted to write, I just started writing what seemed most interesting to see if I would stick with it. It's definitely been more interesting to me and fun to weave in those tidbits in the right places. The first bit of anything I wrote was actually some tiny parts in last week's chapter then I think part of what ended up being the "10th chapter" because I was ready for a dramatic reveal after many years. It feels like I might have placed it too early in the story, but knowing Nick had to get from where he was in PBox to there and then all the way over here through the course of the story, it just felt like it needed to happen sooner rather than being dragged out for drama. Unless I decide to add another chapter in there over the course of the edit? Probably not?

I didn't this time, but it's the first story I've tried it on that didn't already have a beginning completely written. And I definitely had bits and pieces of the beginning from 2015ish, so it wasn't going in completely blind or anything. I think it's harder to say for a sequel than a brand new story too, because it technically already had a beginning that was written -- that's PBox. Ask me again the next time I have a totally new and different story, basically, haha.

There's no right or wrong way to do an outline.  It can be whatever you make it.  Mine all look different depending on what I feel I need to write down for the story.  Some of mine have definitely sounded like yours with lots of questions and ideas that aren't set in stone yet ("What if this happened?"), and I have put little jokes in for myself too LOL.  When I was writing Broken and BMS way back in the day, I had little notebook I kept in my nightstand and would jot barely legible notes in it, sometimes when I was half asleep.  No one else would be able to decipher most of it, but it made sense to me.

That's fair, I've just found my one sentence outlines to be very unhelpful if I come back to them from some time away. I guess questions are the way I lean if I'm not sure because that's what I start off doing when I have a story anyway, asking and answering major questions. I'm glad you write yourself jokes too. They're fun to go back to after you pop away from it for a minute. I always laugh at them the next time I read them.

That's why I love google keep. I definitely have a receipt paper from one of the restaurants I worked at that has some vague scribbles of part of Gobosei on it from right after IAWLT came out on my inspiration station. Keep is nice because I always have my phone on me, so I can start a little document whenever the mood strikes. I love that you kept a notebook for them. Do you still have it?

[RokofAges75]

Being away from writing so long, I just decided that rather than waiting to write the parts I wanted to write, I just started writing what seemed most interesting to see if I would stick with it. It's definitely been more interesting to me and fun to weave in those tidbits in the right places. The first bit of anything I wrote was actually some tiny parts in last week's chapter then I think part of what ended up being the "10th chapter" because I was ready for a dramatic reveal after many years. It feels like I might have placed it too early in the story, but knowing Nick had to get from where he was in PBox to there and then all the way over here through the course of the story, it just felt like it needed to happen sooner rather than being dragged out for drama. Unless I decide to add another chapter in there over the course of the edit? Probably not?

I didn't this time, but it's the first story I've tried it on that didn't already have a beginning completely written. And I definitely had bits and pieces of the beginning from 2015ish, so it wasn't going in completely blind or anything. I think it's harder to say for a sequel than a brand new story too, because it technically already had a beginning that was written -- that's PBox. Ask me again the next time I have a totally new and different story, basically, haha.

I can see how it would be easier to start somewhere in the middle when it's a sequel and you already have the characters and world established.  I do think it would be harder to do that with a brand new story, but you'll have to try it and let us know how it goes.  That being said, I can also see how it might make it easier to complete a story if you write the middle and end first and then just have to go back to the beginning and fill in the gaps to finish it.  That might make it feel like the hard part is over - unless you're someone who struggles most with beginnings.  For me, getting started is often the hardest part, so I don't know if that theory would hold LOL.

Here's a question for everyone:  What do you usually have the hardest time writing - the beginning, the middle, or the end?  How about the easiest?

That's why I love google keep. I definitely have a receipt paper from one of the restaurants I worked at that has some vague scribbles of part of Gobosei on it from right after IAWLT came out on my inspiration station. Keep is nice because I always have my phone on me, so I can start a little document whenever the mood strikes. I love that you kept a notebook for them. Do you still have it?

I haven't used Google Keep before; I'll have to look into that!

Yep, I do still have my Broken notebook.  I'm kind of a low-key hoarder who keeps anything nostalgic LOL.

Anyone else have any writing-related mementos they hang on to?

[FrickingKaos]

I have notebooks upon notebooks of stuff that I wrote in high school, including what would eventually be my Nick and Amanda series. I also have the notebook I started drafting If I Knew Then and Take Me Home in. Lots of notes. I have a notebook where I was writing down stuff for when I wrote Finding Carter too. I kept all of it and once in a while I like to go through them.

[RokofAges75]

How often do they "just go away?"

What a nerd, signing up for a symposium, just kidding! I am also a nerd who loves symposiums. See, and my first thought to you quoting this was "Please call it 'Dougie! Carter, MD'." (I will see myself out again.)

How many docs are in the folder right now?

Do any of your current options feel like "What's next after Bethelehem"? Or do you feel like a new idea will strike?

I dunno... I'm not sure they actually do go away, but that may be because the ones worth remembering eventually get written down.  I have eleven ideas/outlines on Google, and I found nineteen more on my hard drive that I never uploaded to Google because I don't see myself actually writing them... yet I haven't deleted them either.  Of the ones on Google, there are five or six I could see myself attempting to write at some point.  I've thought for three years now that my next project would be a Kevin/Nick drama called "My Brother's Keeper" that I've already written 3 or 4 chapters of, but other ideas keep getting in its way.  If I don't go back to that one after Bethlehem, I'm leaning toward one of my horror/suspense ideas.  Or maybe I'll just take a break until it's time to get going on 00Carter again.  Or maybe I'll get a brand new idea.  Who knows!  I'm not gonna worry about it until I actually finish Bethlehem.

Dying at "Dougie! Carter, M.D."    There is something to be said for a good, funny title.  I've held on to an idea for years about Brian being possessed, but there are two versions of the idea.  One is a serious horror story, and the other is a comedy I would call "The Devil Wears Wylee." LOL  The serious version would make a better story, but damn if I don't love that title LOL.  Maybe I can work it into a future pandaskunk story instead.

How long does it typically take you to go back to an idea? I feel like PNecklace has in some form been jumbled in my head for the past decade, but I'm doing it now like that author who writes a chapter, deletes, and then rewrites from memory because I have long ago lost any written record of what it was early on post-PBox. I'm so appreciative of the Google suite.

I love how you can recover old versions of a file in Google.  It's fun to see how stories and ideas evolve over time.  The thought of deleting a chapter and rewriting it from memory gives me anxiety though LOL.  Do you save a copy of the original so you can refer back to it after or while you rewrite?

It seems like the stories I've been most successful with (a.k.a. the ones I actually finish) are based on newer ideas, not old ones.  I think the longest I've hung on to an idea before writing it is about six years.  I got the original idea for Guilty Roads around 2004, and I started writing it in 2010.  But although I got far enough to post it, I still haven't finished it, so I'm not sure I'd call that successful.  Another one with a big time gap was the ER crossover I finished last year, Heroic Measures.  I wrote the first two chapters of that story in 2012, finished two more in 2018, and wrote the rest in 2020.  It took me 8 years to write a ten-chapter novella LOL, but at least I did finally finish it, so I consider that one a success.

Has anyone else had luck resurrecting really old ideas or unfinished stories?

I knew you did! Which was why I wanted to learn more about your experience with it and what you do with it once you've gotten what you need. How much of that medical jargon and in-depth research ends up in your works? Or is it like your version of world building where you know twice as much to avoid plot holes.

That sounds fascinating and I will definitely check it out, but I for sure gagged at it being described as "peel back layers," though I'm sure that's exactly what it is.

Yeah, I guess it is like my own version of world building.  I don't include everything I learn in my stories because I don't want them to read like a medical journal LOL.  I've found that doctor characters are good for taking the jargon and info I feel the other characters and readers need to understand and breaking it down into laymen's terms. Usually those are just minor characters, but my last two medical dramas had main characters who were doctors or nurses, so when I was writing from their perspective, I did include more jargon and detailed medical info, which was fun.  

LOL!  Don't worry, it's not gory.  It's more like a interactive 3D CGI diagram, not real photos or anything.

Did you ever write HP fanfic outside of that crossover? I'm not very versed in HP (which seems odd given all this), but can you just tell me what houses the Boys were in? I'm just curious if we have similar opinions.

I started a HP fanfic once back in like 2003, but I didn't get past the first few chapters.  I love Harry Potter; it's my number two fandom after BSB, but I've just never gotten into fanfic for any other fandom, reading or writing.  In my crossover, the Boys are Muggles (non-magic), so they're not sorted into Houses.  But if I were the Sorting Hat, I would probably put Brian and Nick in Gryffindor, Howie and AJ in Hufflepuff, and Kevin in Ravenclaw.  Although Nick's nerdy science posts make me think he might actually be more of a Ravenclaw too.  As Dumbledore once said, "You know, I sometimes think we Sort too soon."  Where do you think they would go?  (Anyone can weigh in on this.)

[RokofAges75]

I have notebooks upon notebooks of stuff that I wrote in high school, including what would eventually be my Nick and Amanda series. I also have the notebook I started drafting If I Knew Then and Take Me Home in. Lots of notes. I have a notebook where I was writing down stuff for when I wrote Finding Carter too. I kept all of it and once in a while I like to go through them.

Do you use a different notebook for each story?

I rarely write by hand, but I have several random old notebooks with just a few pages of fanfic ideas or scenes written in them.  If I were smarter, I would have gotten myself one nice notebook and put everything in there, instead of all over the place in used Five Star notebooks leftover from high school and college LOL.

[nicksgal]

I can see how it would be easier to start somewhere in the middle when it's a sequel and you already have the characters and world established.  I do think it would be harder to do that with a brand new story, but you'll have to try it and let us know how it goes.  That being said, I can also see how it might make it easier to complete a story if you write the middle and end first and then just have to go back to the beginning and fill in the gaps to finish it.  That might make it feel like the hard part is over - unless you're someone who struggles most with beginnings.  For me, getting started is often the hardest part, so I don't know if that theory would hold LOL.

Here's a question for everyone:  What do you usually have the hardest time writing - the beginning, the middle, or the end?  How about the easiest?

When I have a new idea, I will let you know! Could be never. Could be next week.

I started so many things over the years, so I would say middles are alright if I get to them. It's the between the beginning and middle I often find hard, but then if I can't get at least halfway-ish through the story, then I'll never figure out an end. We'll see if this way is easier overall, because it's definitely been easier to fill in gaps between already written scenes than it was going in order.

Yep, I do still have my Broken notebook.  I'm kind of a low-key hoarder who keeps anything nostalgic LOL.

Anyone else have any writing-related mementos they hang on to?

Next time you go on purging binge, don't purge it! Save it forever and put it in a Julie museum!

I'd say my doodles? I used to physically print out my stories back when I had my ancient desktop. I bet I have a very old version of PBox on a floppy disk somewhere, haha.

[nicksgal]

I have notebooks upon notebooks of stuff that I wrote in high school, including what would eventually be my Nick and Amanda series. I also have the notebook I started drafting If I Knew Then and Take Me Home in. Lots of notes. I have a notebook where I was writing down stuff for when I wrote Finding Carter too. I kept all of it and once in a while I like to go through them.

Do you use a different notebook for each story?

I rarely write by hand, but I have several random old notebooks with just a few pages of fanfic ideas or scenes written in them.  If I were smarter, I would have gotten myself one nice notebook and put everything in there, instead of all over the place in used Five Star notebooks leftover from high school and college LOL.

I love that you guys kept notebooks! My hand hurts if I write by hand too long and I can definitely type faster than I can write and my brain sometimes goes a mile a minute, so typing is my preference (thank goodness for technology). I know I have part of PBox ch. 23 written on a piece of notebook paper somewhere and I found the tiniest part of zombies in my art binder last night.

Just rip them out, put them in page protectors, and transfer into a binder... Or at least, next time you want a time consuming project, haha.

[RokofAges75]

Next time you go on purging binge, don't purge it! Save it forever and put it in a Julie museum!

It has moved with me from my parents' house to my first apartment to my own house, so it's safe to say I will not be purging it.  Though I do have this fear of dying and my family finding things like that when they go through my stuff and being like "WTF?" LOL.  At least that notebook is mostly just random notes that would seem incoherent out of context of knowing what it was for.