Fic Talk > General Discussion
Writing & Thread (aka The Writing Thread 4)
RokofAges75:
--- Quote from: nicksgal on June 26, 2021, 11:41:51 PM ---You're absolutely right on that! I think it's one of those things where if you put it in after doing your due diligence on research, no one notices, but if it's inaccurate, people will notice. And then compound that with the things you would notice and it becomes this rabbit hole of distraction. I think people would notice if you hadn't figured out how they got a movie that wouldn't be on TV yet (or released yet). But you would notice that Ten Commandments was shown the day before. Oh, you should have them watch The Prince of Egypt; that's a fun Easter romp, lol.
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I thought about The Prince of Egypt! But in the course of my research on when The Ten Commandments aired on TV in 2008, I learned that Passover was almost a month later than Easter that year, and Prince of Egypt is technically more of a Passover movie. I even looked up other Easter movies for ideas, but nothing really stood out to me as something I needed Nick and Kevin to watch, so I just left it unnamed. Some of the titles that came up as "Easter movies" were pretty funny though. Like Monty Python and the Holy Grail?? It has a killer bunny in it; I guess that makes it an Easter movie? LOL I thought about using that one because I felt like they would pick something light and funny if it wasn't just whatever was on TV at the time, but I've already referenced that movie in another story.
--- Quote from: nicksgal on June 26, 2021, 11:41:51 PM ---This same type of thing has led to a little heartache for me today (tell me why...). I wanted this "Nick avoids being the main character" to be vaguely Millennium in time period (as my writing often is), but I'd forgotten that they started the tour in Europe, which works out less with my plans. They did have about a month long break between the European leg and the North American leg, but I'm pretty sure at least half of that was hurricane season-related (if memory serves correctly), and I can't imagine they'd have a "re-tour rehearsal," even if they had a month off, from a tour they'd been performing for three months at that point. Now part of me says, "Eh, it's a novella vaguely implied to take place before ITM, it's going to be fine" and part of me is like "Someone will know and call me out on it." See? This is the type of stuff that makes me more impressed with y'all's ability to be able to weave story into history instead of my "I can make that up with enough time and related research."
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That is the downside to using real timelines, when the real events of that time period don't work well with your story idea. Does it have to be Millennium era? Could you use Black & Blue instead? The B&B tour started in the U.S. But I get the appeal of using Millennium; that whole era was so iconic, between the album, the tour, and their popularity at the time. It was a better era than B&B, even though they're so close together.
Although I like to use real details when I can, I will say that since you're already taking BSB fanfic tropes and twisting them by making Nick a background character, you could keep the setting intentionally vague. A lot of fics, especially back in the day, weren't very specific about where or when they were taking place, and if they were, it wasn't always true to life. So I think you could get away with that if you wanted to.
--- Quote from: nicksgal on June 26, 2021, 11:41:51 PM ---LMAO! That was my genuine reaction to reading this, but seems out of place. Let me explain. I did vaguely remember that it was Pulp Fiction, but wanted something less... gritty due to what they were talking about in the scene that actually mattered. I enjoyed that you linked me that Rotten Tomatoes article as that is the exact article I used to justify choosing Dirty Rotten Scoundrels for my vague "[movie]" placeholder. I'm sorry, I should have mentioned more explicitly in my recount that I had finished this research project already. I appreciate you taking the time to help me all the same. *hugs*
The first time I read that Rotten Tomatoes article though, I did shout "Nick, The Goonies!" at my phone like an idiot, lol.
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LOL Great minds think alike! Dirty Rotten Scoundrels sounds like a great choice. I did the same thing with Nick's pick, except I was like, "Nick, what about Aliens??" In his defense, it is hard to pick just one favorite. Not for me - mine will always be Titanic - but I have a much harder time picking, say, a favorite song because there are so many good ones. Jaws is a great movie though.
--- Quote from: nicksgal on June 26, 2021, 11:41:51 PM ---I should start using [Name] for minor characters. I would do something equally annoying like writing "the doctor" a million times and growing to loathe it, especially if it's in dialogue where a character wouldn't reasonably say "our gym teacher" or something like that. Thank goodness for the "name thread"! I think it's good that you have a list for names of minor characters. I think that's equally helpful as a fellow overthinker.
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The name thread was so helpful! Erik, my douchey frat boy character I started that thread for, finally made his first appearance a few chapters ago.
--- Quote from: nicksgal on June 26, 2021, 11:41:51 PM ---What time did you go to bed yesterday/wake up today? Are you liking night writing better due to the less distractions? On NaNo, I feel bad about fudging it, but I will consider post-midnight "today" if I haven't gone to bed yet and started writing whatever during today. If I got back to it at midnight, I would call it "tomorrow." Yay, new chapter! I believe!
Yes! I have done ten loads of laundry so far. I'm slowly getting through my items that need to be washed separately.
We'll see how productive my night goes. Here I am posting on the forum again at 10:30pm, lol. I wrote about 500 words this afternoon, but looked up one thing I thought would be such an easy question and... no, it was not easy. It really derailed me and complicated things leading to further research. So now here I am adding a scene that I hadn't really planned on writing that's just making me feel bummed out because of a dedication to certain types of details (as opposed to accurate timelines, lol). Sigh... :-[
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Ugh, my sleep schedule has been so messed up the last few days, even more so than usual. My current pattern is that I will go to bed well after sunrise, sleep until early afternoon, get tired at night because I only slept 5-6 hours instead of my preferred 8-9, think "Oh good, I will go to bed at a normal time tonight and reset my sleep schedule," go to bed at a normal time, wake up around 2 a.m., get back up, and don't go back to bed until well after sunrise, thus continuing the cycle. I went to bed at like 10 last night, read for an hour or so, and fell asleep. Woke up at 1 something, wide awake, and tried to read until I got sleepy again. I finished my book and was still wide awake, so I got back up. Now it's 7 a.m. LOL. So much for resetting my sleep schedule. I also still haven't started my chapter because I spent my pre-dawn writing time watching TV and replying to posts on this forum instead. LOL
How did the rest of your night go? I hope we both have a productive day today!
nicksgal:
--- Quote from: RokofAges75 on June 27, 2021, 06:22:05 AM ---LOL Small ideas are nice! It's fun to be able to finish a story in under a year. But there is also something to be said for the feeling accomplishment that comes with finishing an epic story or series.
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Yes, all of this. This is where I get in trouble for comparing again. I have to stop looking at r/fanfic because all the people that talk about how many stories they finish in a month and I always think "how?!" lol
--- Quote from: RokofAges75 on June 27, 2021, 06:22:05 AM ---Don't tempt me with the BSB cruise shipwreck idea LOL. It's not a bad idea, although it'd be better if it was just the boys and not the boys plus thousands of their fans on the boat.
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Always here to make joke and tempt, lol. See, the Boys get in a lifeboat, but the regular boat manages to be just fine. All the fans get saved, but now the Boys are adrift in a lifeboat, lol. I think these days, a shipwreck on a cruise boat would be way less common than in Titanic times.
--- Quote from: RokofAges75 on June 27, 2021, 06:22:05 AM ---I agree about the vague "I wanna write a story like this one" idea. I've always struggled the most with ideas that I forced out while trying to emulate something else I read or watched. Secrets of the Heart and Guilty Roads were both those types of ideas, and I had a hard time with both of them. I finished Secrets, but only because I forced myself to. I've learned that it's better to sit on those vague "I wanna write a survival story" or "I wanna write a bromance" thoughts until an actual idea comes along that works with them.
I really can only remember doing that once, where I finished the first story early and saved the rest for a sequel that I never ended up writing. It was with The Other Child, my only experience writing on "on demand" story that a reader gave me the idea for. I thought the idea was kinda cool at first, but I got bored with it and just wanted to finish it, so I slapped a quick ending on it and said I would write a sequel to continue the story. I guess back then it was more important to me to finish a story before moving on to the next one than to write it well, whereas now I guess I'd rather have on on an indefinite hiatus than ruin it by forcing out a crappy ending. I have other old stories that I had planned a sequel for and never wrote or finished, but at least the first stories were finished in a way I was happy with at the time.
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It's why I've sat on my jokes until I thought about them solidly enough. I think that's something I needed to learn back then too. I feel like my life was WADD until PBox, really. I'd write and post any old thing in my head. And then at some point during PBox (probably about a year in?) I made the conscious decision to put everything on hold until PBox was finished, of course that took a whole other year and a half, but I stopped starting new things. And then after that, I decided to only focus on Beta Sig. I think it's been better for me in the long run to only focus on one thing at a time without getting too derailed. I was thinking just the other day that I should do my utmost to make AJ important in a story at some point and here we are, a good place to do it. :)
I remember you talking about that one before. If a reader suggested it, I can see why you want to make sure it had an end, rather than leaving them hanging for an indefinite amount of time. But that the idea came from someone else probably also had something to do with you getting bored with it.
--- Quote from: RokofAges75 on June 27, 2021, 06:22:05 AM ---Yep, I agree with all of this. If you do have several scenes you wrote that did not make it into the final draft of the story, you could always post them as like a "deleted scenes" bonus feature, too. That would be fun! Since I don't write ahead, I don't usually find myself with deleted scenes like this. When I do hack and slash a chapter, I end up actually deleting what didn't make it into the final draft. Maybe I shouldn't do that because it might be fun to go back and look at the original versions, but as we've discussed previously, I can't stand having multiple versions of stories junking up my folders LOL.
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If I don't rework mine, I do save them, but not to the extent that they would be any good bonus feature. Some chapters I ended up writing for OF PBox are the only thing I have like this because they would fill something that wasn't there before. In writing PNecklace, with the extensive editing I do, I've found that I'm usually able to work ideas in at different points, at least in spirit. There's definitely part of me that wishes I could do it with a whole novel before posting, but I don't have that kind of backlog at the moment, lol.
I know you don't. So you've got to weigh the options: fun bonus content or peace of mind? lol
--- Quote from: RokofAges75 on June 27, 2021, 06:22:05 AM ---I always at least have to have a title, outline, summary, banner, and a solid first chapter before I would post anything, but with my last few stories, I've waited till I finished about ten chapters to start posting, and that has worked out well. I think I started posting Heroic Measures when I was on Chapter 8 because I knew it was only going to be ten chapters plus an epilogue, so I was close to finishing. With SAMS, I waited all the way until Chapter 18 because I used a scene from that chapter in the prologue, but I didn't actually write it until I got to that point in the story. It depends on the plot, too, but I usually wait until I get past the inciting incident and into the heart of the story to make sure it's going well before I post.
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I agree that ten chapters seems like a solid backlog. I feel far enough in to keep going and reasonably feel like I can get another ten chapters finished within ten weeks. I'm probably a little faster than that, to be honest (at least for the most part).
With SAMS, do you mean that you planned for a scene from Chapter 18 to be in the Prologue, but didn't write the prologue until after you'd written Chapter 18 or that you wrote the tiny part that was in the prologue in the beginning, but didn't finish the whole scene until you got to Chapter 18? Either way, interesting way to do it.
I think it makes sense to get past the inciting incident because then you know that the action's kicked off. I feel like I always put my inciting incidents fairly early in the story, within the first chapter if not the second. Do you feel yours are a little later? Or just that the "heart of the story" takes more time to get into after that?
--- Quote from: RokofAges75 on June 27, 2021, 06:22:05 AM ---I may have been a little off on my conception date for Guilty Roads LOL. I know that idea was on a poll I posted in the early 2000s about which story I should write next, but I checked, and it was in 2004, not 2001-2002. It was one of the ideas I accumulated while working on Broken/BMS. It's listed here under the working title "Austere Refuge," which I later changed. https://web.archive.org/web/20041121170941/http://dreamers-sanctuary.com/nextstory.html The idea evolved over time, but the basic premise was always the same. I probably would have started it sooner if I wasn't in the middle of writing BMS. Then came the epic collabs, 00Carter and Undead, so I didn't get around to it until 2010. So I sat on the idea for at least six years before I started writing it. It's the only one of those six ideas that even got that far. I did start #2, but never got far enough to post it.
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It might not be you, I might have been off on my math! I guessed around 2003 (which is fairly close to 2004), but couldn't remember if you'd finished Broken by then or not. Was Guilty Roads the one that had won that poll or was it a different one? I get starting #2, you've gotta love a good reincarnation plotline. Did you do these types of polls often or was this more of a one time thing?
--- Quote from: RokofAges75 on June 27, 2021, 06:22:05 AM ---I think there are different levels of naggy/jumpy. MBK and Heroic Measures were both ideas that I felt strongly enough about that I knew I would come back to them someday. They were patiently naggy, if that makes any sense LOL. Whereas the other stories I wrote while those two were waiting in the background, AHTIM and Bethlehem, were more demanding. AHTIM was one I just had to get out of my head, and Bethlehem was a "must write now" idea because of its timing with the pandemic. If I didn't jump on it and get it written last year while all that craziness was going on, I probably wouldn't have ever written it.
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They're your AJ compared to Nick, lol. "Hey, if you've got time, I have some stuff to do... No pressure." versus "I'MMMMM BAAAACCCCKKKK, ALLLRIIGHT!" I get it. I felt the same way about my little holiday story as Bethlehem. I could have written it for this Christmas, but the time just seemed right last year. :) I like the patiently naggy ones. They feel much more comforting.
--- Quote from: RokofAges75 on June 27, 2021, 06:22:05 AM ---So I haven't written anything on MBK since my last post, but I did finish reading Where the Crawdad Sings! It was good. Not the best book I've ever read, but it definitely got better as it went along. I liked how it turned out.
That is usually me on Prime Day too; I can never think of anything expensive I want to look for deals on. I would definitely recommend the Kitchenaid mixer though! I got one for Christmas a few years ago, and I love it. It's super cute on my counter (I got the Aqua Sky color), and it makes mixing anything so easy. I can just turn it on and let it go. (Only I learned the hard way that if you walk away and leave it too long while whipping cream, it overwhips the cream and makes it all chunky and gross looking. Whoops!) Maybe wait and get one on a Black Friday/Christmas deal.
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Glad you finished it! Now if that's out of your head, you'll have more space for your puzzle and MBK, lol.
Your poor whipped cream, lol! I'd asked for one for our wedding, but I think I haven't been thinking about it because we just don't have space for it on our counter or in our cabinets. Once I get back to organizing, maybe I can make some space for it though. I like the yellow one. I keep vaguely telling hubs that a yellow kitchen would be nice, but then he reminds me that I also want a yellow house. I know better than to ask for AJ's pink kitchen, haha.
I did get my old fitbit on Prime Day a couple years ago and that was awesome. My new one just came after not having a working one for a couple months, so that's been exciting. I wish they warned me Prime Day was coming, so I could start thinking about what I might need, lol.
--- Quote from: RokofAges75 on June 27, 2021, 06:22:05 AM ---Thanks! I will post pictures when it's all done. I'm debating if I want to repaint the walls before I put everything up. They're a neutral beige color that works fine with the stuff I ordered, but there are a couple places where the paint is peeling, and the wall has screw holes in it from whatever the previous homeowner had hanging there, so I probably should do it right, patch up the walls, and give them a fresh coat of paint. I'm gonna get some paint chips and see if I like another color better. I'm not a beige fan, but if it turns out beige works best, I probably will just leave it as is instead of wasting my time and money painting it beige again LOL.
OMG, that sounds like a hotel I need to stay at! I would love that. Of course I ordered a print of the creepy twins to hang up so they can stare at people as they do their business, hehe.
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Yes, can't wait! "Redrum" would really pop if the background was beige or neutral, just saying, lol. I wonder if you could cover up the screw holes with some other picture.
I know, I'd temporarily forgotten about it, but knew it was up your alley. There's also the actual Stanley Hotel if you're doing an epic Colorado tourist trip, lol. I'm glad you did. I would expect nothing less for this "Shining" bathroom.
--- Quote from: RokofAges75 on June 27, 2021, 06:22:05 AM ---All that makes sense. I agree about things that come up in the moment having more of an emotional impact than things you've planned out in advance.
I would guess it's usually the same scenes that make readers tear up, but maybe not always. Everyone reacts differently, and you never know what's going to trigger someone. There's a part in Curtain Call where Charlotte's Web is quoted, and that's what will get me. I don't know if I'm tearing up because the scene itself is sad, which it is, or because Charlotte's Web is sad. Probably both.
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Do you often have ideas that come up in the moment as your writing or do most of them end up in the outline ahead of time?
You're probably right on all of that. And Charlotte's Web is so sad, so I can imagine being doubly sad if the scene itself is sad.
--- Quote from: RokofAges75 on June 27, 2021, 06:22:05 AM ---Thanks for googling that! That aligns with what I was thinking as well. Maybe Nick was just annoyed with those guys interviewing him who didn't seem to know anything about him. I haven't watched the whole video in years, but I remember being annoyed with that interview until it got to the pubic hair part LOL.
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I guess I would have been annoyed too. They were really focused on Nick, but not on Howie at all. Poor Howie. They finally let him talk and he's hilarious.
--- Quote from: RokofAges75 on June 27, 2021, 06:22:05 AM ---Yep, I think taking away the boyband thing is an important step. A band/musician story really is better suited to TV or movies where you can actually show them performing and play the music. The brotherly relationship could work in a lot of contexts, though. Mare kept it in her published novel by making them actual brothers. In my Broken OF novel idea, they were all going to be high school friends/teammates. They could also be coworkers, college friends/roommates or frat brothers, neighbors, etc.
I think with Broken, I just cared most about preserving my couple, "Nick and Claire." It just wouldn't sound right with different names LOL.
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...Heroes thrust together by destiny, lol. I think of all the things I've cut, the brotherly relationship and Nick as is are what's been most important to keep for me. It's just really not the same story without it. Now I've had to tweak it some to make it feel more earned, but on a whole, it's been preserved.
LOL! I get that. I wanted to keep Nick the same because he's my tiny muse. And I could see myself flubbing it up if I renamed him more than the others.
nicksgal:
--- Quote from: RokofAges75 on June 27, 2021, 06:40:21 AM ---All that world-building seems like a fun challenge, but definitely daunting! I love your attention to detail in thinking about how geography would affect each country's economy and culture; that makes a lot of sense.
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Yeah, there's the online software called "WorldAnvil" that makes all of this much more streamlined, that I've looked into, but have been hesitant to get, and it's probably time to just do it. It keeps everything on the cloud too, which is nice. It's like having your own complicated wikipedia, lol. And thanks. What else would I do with my now vast knowledge of the desert? lol
--- Quote from: RokofAges75 on June 27, 2021, 06:40:21 AM ---As far as being problematic, I'm sure we can all look back on our older stories and find examples of that. I know when I was reading Broken last year for my blog, I was struck by how misogynistic it sounded. I have always said Broken Nick acts like an emo teenage girl, but I forgot how much he gets ripped on for being that way in the story, by the other guys and even by himself. I apparently had more of an awareness of that as I was writing it than I realized LOL. There are so many jokes to the effect of comparing Nick to a girl on her period, as well as jokes about the actual women in the story. Reading it back, I'm not sure if I wrote it that way because that's how I thought real guys talked and thought (which is probably not too off-base) or if I was being the misogynistic one LOL, but it's definitely something that hadn't stood out to me that way before.
But as far as PBox goes, any potentially problematic parts can hopefully be edited out as you're reworking it for OF.
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OMG, yes! The misogyny! It's interesting that you had an awareness for it that seeped into the writing without you realizing. I remember doing the same thing back then. I cringed a little rereading Beta Sig when Nick was monologing about how much he liked talking to Brian and literally thinks something to the effect of "I sound like a girl that wants to date Brian." (Misogynistic and homophobic! I'm the worst!) I think that's something that can happen with all creative works. They're really a product of their time, so even something praised can become something with cringey aspects over the years. Heck, look at Hamilton. Initially praised for its diversity in cast, now judged for "Founders Chic" and lack of diverse characters.
I think so. Awareness is the first step! Action is the second!
--- Quote from: RokofAges75 on June 27, 2021, 06:40:21 AM ---Kidnapped doesn't mean he has to be missing from the story. Maybe he and Nick get kidnapped or put in a hostage situation together, but AJ gets to be the hero who fights back and plans their escape, while Nick just cowers in a corner and sleeps LOL. Giving AJ a disease is also a way to make him the center of attention. Just don't put him in a coma or cripple him if you want him to be mobile LOL.
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A valid point! AJ would be pretty badass, but probably sprain his ankle from his tight pants, lol. What do you mean I can't put AJ in coma and have him be important? I thought this story was "AJ is Nick's guardian angel"?! LMAO!
My next related thought, and I'd love to be corrected if I'm wrong. Brian's been involved in pretty much everything Nick's been involved in to some degree, though not in a while, if I'm remembering correctly... I'm probably fine to just pick whatever, yeah?
--- Quote from: RokofAges75 on June 27, 2021, 06:40:21 AM ---LOL Absolutely! AJ and Joey were both fantastic in that movie. Remember when it was originally going to be a movie called Evil Blessings about backwoods cannibals or something? Obviously I love zombies, but I still wish he would write that movie too. I also wanna see him play the villain instead of the hero! I guess he was kind of a villain in The Hollow, but not the main one. I'm also still disappointed that he did not get decapitated in that movie LOL.
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I do! I wonder why he changed from backwoods cannibals to zombies? I'm guessing Kevin hated it. LMAO! Nick the villain. He would be such a large ham! You watched Dr. Horrible, right? That's the type of villain I see Nick being.
LOL! The Headless Horseman would be lucky to get Nick's head, even though his hair was only okay in that film.
nicksgal:
--- Quote from: RokofAges75 on June 27, 2021, 07:08:10 AM ---I thought about The Prince of Egypt! But in the course of my research on when The Ten Commandments aired on TV in 2008, I learned that Passover was almost a month later than Easter that year, and Prince of Egypt is technically more of a Passover movie. I even looked up other Easter movies for ideas, but nothing really stood out to me as something I needed Nick and Kevin to watch, so I just left it unnamed. Some of the titles that came up as "Easter movies" were pretty funny though. Like Monty Python and the Holy Grail?? It has a killer bunny in it; I guess that makes it an Easter movie? LOL I thought about using that one because I felt like they would pick something light and funny if it wasn't just whatever was on TV at the time, but I've already referenced that movie in another story.
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You're totally right, it is more of a Passover movie. It's just the second thing I think of when I think of The Ten Commandments, lol. LMAO! If "has a bunny" is the only qualification for an Easter movie, then is Donnie Darko an Easter movie? Monty Python and the Holy Grail is a classic though.
--- Quote from: RokofAges75 on June 27, 2021, 07:08:10 AM ---That is the downside to using real timelines, when the real events of that time period don't work well with your story idea. Does it have to be Millennium era? Could you use Black & Blue instead? The B&B tour started in the U.S. But I get the appeal of using Millennium; that whole era was so iconic, between the album, the tour, and their popularity at the time. It was a better era than B&B, even though they're so close together.
Although I like to use real details when I can, I will say that since you're already taking BSB fanfic tropes and twisting them by making Nick a background character, you could keep the setting intentionally vague. A lot of fics, especially back in the day, weren't very specific about where or when they were taking place, and if they were, it wasn't always true to life. So I think you could get away with that if you wanted to.
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It's not really anything tied to an era outside of being "classic Backstreet," but as usual, it's easier to blissfully avoid their lives away from BSB if you go earlier than Brian and Kevin's weddings, lol. I think I could get away with it too. It being a dramedy poking the edge of satire doesn't require intense grounding in reality. Although, now that I'm thinking about it, how would they get their stage set overseas? Did they have a second one constructed over there or did it just fly over in a cargo plane? I could probably still make my idea work just fine even if they had to go to Europe first; it really ends before the tour starts. What are the chances anyone has created a detailed timeline of their lives between Millennium getting released and embarking on the tour? This would probably help me out a lot.
--- Quote from: RokofAges75 on June 27, 2021, 07:08:10 AM ---LOL Great minds think alike! Dirty Rotten Scoundrels sounds like a great choice. I did the same thing with Nick's pick, except I was like, "Nick, what about Aliens??" In his defense, it is hard to pick just one favorite. Not for me - mine will always be Titanic - but I have a much harder time picking, say, a favorite song because there are so many good ones. Jaws is a great movie though.
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Indeed. It's not Nick's fault. The majority of movies that came out in the '80s were awesome, so it's hard to choose between them. I'm very loyal. I pick a favorite and I stick with it. Movie, band, song, Backstreet Boy, whatever. Stuck, lol. All good, because Titanic, the Boys, QPG, and Nick are all great, lol.
--- Quote from: RokofAges75 on June 27, 2021, 07:08:10 AM ---The name thread was so helpful! Erik, my douchey frat boy character I started that thread for, finally made his first appearance a few chapters ago.
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Yes! Thank you for creating it. Ooh, glad Erik has finally come around. Hopefully he's working out for you. :)
--- Quote from: RokofAges75 on June 27, 2021, 07:08:10 AM ---Ugh, my sleep schedule has been so messed up the last few days, even more so than usual. My current pattern is that I will go to bed well after sunrise, sleep until early afternoon, get tired at night because I only slept 5-6 hours instead of my preferred 8-9, think "Oh good, I will go to bed at a normal time tonight and reset my sleep schedule," go to bed at a normal time, wake up around 2 a.m., get back up, and don't go back to bed until well after sunrise, thus continuing the cycle. I went to bed at like 10 last night, read for an hour or so, and fell asleep. Woke up at 1 something, wide awake, and tried to read until I got sleepy again. I finished my book and was still wide awake, so I got back up. Now it's 7 a.m. LOL. So much for resetting my sleep schedule. I also still haven't started my chapter because I spent my pre-dawn writing time watching TV and replying to posts on this forum instead. LOL
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Oh no! Sorry you're waking up in the middle of the night. I absolutely hate when that happens. :( I hope you got some good sleep in eventually. Maybe if you're up at 7am tomorrow, you can take a quick nap instead of sleeping until you wake up and that will right it a little. Hopefully writing is going productively since you woke up.
--- Quote from: RokofAges75 on June 27, 2021, 07:08:10 AM ---How did the rest of your night go? I hope we both have a productive day today!
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It did not, lol. Instead of writing, I decided now was a great time to start making a Google Sheet to keep track of my word counts, lol.
Today was cooking day, so I got a later start, then tried to get on with my next scene, but ended up texting my BFF to get some medical issue questions answered in more layman's terms than google was giving me, lol. So now I have a bunch of medical knowledge for only a scene, but it will be so accurate. Unlike my Backstreet timeline, lol. I've written 47 words today, lol.
Edited to Add: Oh, I didn't name the story yet, but the first chapter has a name "Chapter One: My World is Half Asleep, or How I, Nick Carter, am a Victim of Circumstance"
RokofAges75:
--- Quote from: nicksgal on June 27, 2021, 06:31:26 PM ---Yes, all of this. This is where I get in trouble for comparing again. I have to stop looking at r/fanfic because all the people that talk about how many stories they finish in a month and I always think "how?!" lol
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Yeah, but just think, most of those are one-shots. For novelists like us, it's more comparable to talk about how many chapters we finish in a month LOL.
--- Quote from: nicksgal on June 27, 2021, 06:31:26 PM ---Always here to make joke and tempt, lol. See, the Boys get in a lifeboat, but the regular boat manages to be just fine. All the fans get saved, but now the Boys are adrift in a lifeboat, lol. I think these days, a shipwreck on a cruise boat would be way less common than in Titanic times.
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Yes, and then their lifeboat sinks LOL. Love it. Yeah, in reality, a shipwreck nowadays would be much less disastrous because of all the safety regulations that were put in place BECAUSE of Titanic. They have to have enough lifeboats for everyone now and do a lifeboat drill before departure. When that cruise ship capsized off the coast of Italy a few years ago, I think only 30 some people died compared to 1,500 with Titanic - and that was probably a bigger boat with more people on it in the first place. So it would definitely be a stretch. I would probably stick with Nick's personal boat sinking over an entire cruise ship because that seems more plausible. He seems to have had a lot of issues with boats over the years LOL.
--- Quote from: nicksgal on June 27, 2021, 06:31:26 PM ---It's why I've sat on my jokes until I thought about them solidly enough. I think that's something I needed to learn back then too. I feel like my life was WADD until PBox, really. I'd write and post any old thing in my head. And then at some point during PBox (probably about a year in?) I made the conscious decision to put everything on hold until PBox was finished, of course that took a whole other year and a half, but I stopped starting new things. And then after that, I decided to only focus on Beta Sig. I think it's been better for me in the long run to only focus on one thing at a time without getting too derailed. I was thinking just the other day that I should do my utmost to make AJ important in a story at some point and here we are, a good place to do it. :)
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I was pretty good at only focusing on one story at a time until my novels started getting longer and it took me longer than a month to finish them. That's when I started overlapping stories, which can definitely become overwhelming. I used to like having a main project and a side project so I always had something to work on even when I was feeling uninspired on my main story, but even that seems like too much for me now. Like you, I've found I'm most successful at finishing things when I stick to one story at a time. Hopefully your Nick-is-not-the-main-character story will give AJ a time to shine. It took me me 13 years to write a Howie novel and 21 to get to Kevin, so I hear you. But I also see nothing wrong with writing lots of Nick stories. ;)
--- Quote from: nicksgal on June 27, 2021, 06:31:26 PM ---If I don't rework mine, I do save them, but not to the extent that they would be any good bonus feature. Some chapters I ended up writing for OF PBox are the only thing I have like this because they would fill something that wasn't there before. In writing PNecklace, with the extensive editing I do, I've found that I'm usually able to work ideas in at different points, at least in spirit. There's definitely part of me that wishes I could do it with a whole novel before posting, but I don't have that kind of backlog at the moment, lol.
I know you don't. So you've got to weigh the options: fun bonus content or peace of mind? lol
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Yeah, I'm the same as far as not having enough for fun bonus features. Whatever I originally wrote is usually similar enough to what I ended up with that I'm not sure anyone else would enjoy reading it. The only ones I kinda wish I still had are the original beginnings for AHTIM because they were both so different from each other and from the third and final version. That was a lesson in perseverance for me, and it might have been interesting for people who read that story to see all the different ways I planned for Nick to get from Point A to Point B in the first few chapters.
--- Quote from: nicksgal on June 27, 2021, 06:31:26 PM ---I agree that ten chapters seems like a solid backlog. I feel far enough in to keep going and reasonably feel like I can get another ten chapters finished within ten weeks. I'm probably a little faster than that, to be honest (at least for the most part).
With SAMS, do you mean that you planned for a scene from Chapter 18 to be in the Prologue, but didn't write the prologue until after you'd written Chapter 18 or that you wrote the tiny part that was in the prologue in the beginning, but didn't finish the whole scene until you got to Chapter 18? Either way, interesting way to do it.
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I am usually a little slower than that, but have managed to stay 8-9 chapters ahead of myself most of the time. I was able to maintain weekly updates all the way through my last three finished multi-chapter stories - AHTIM, Heroic Measures, and Bethlehem - and so far so good with MBK.
With SAMS, I wrote everything in order except the prologue. So I wrote Chapter 18 after 17 and then used an excerpt from it as my prologue. I didn't originally plan on having a prologue, but I felt like my beginning needed a little something extra to create suspense. I knew that scene would be coming eventually, so I waited until I got to that point in the story to write it and put it in as a prologue. Then I was finally ready to start posting the story.
--- Quote from: nicksgal on June 27, 2021, 06:31:26 PM ---I think it makes sense to get past the inciting incident because then you know that the action's kicked off. I feel like I always put my inciting incidents fairly early in the story, within the first chapter if not the second. Do you feel yours are a little later? Or just that the "heart of the story" takes more time to get into after that?
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From a storytelling perspective, that seems like the best place for the inciting incident - within the first couple chapters. As I think about my stories, that's usually about where mine fall, too, but sometimes there's another pivotal moment or twist that comes up a little later, and that's really the point I want to get to to feel like I'm in the heart of the story. Like with Bethlehem, I guess the inciting incident is the guys going to the cabin in Chapter 1, but really, the part I was waiting to get past was the car crash in Chapter 5 that kicks off the survival part of the story. Curtain Call was similar - the inciting incident technically happened in Chapter 2, but the cancer bomb doesn't get dropped until the end of Chapter 5, which is a bigger moment in the story. I have definitely shored it up since Broken, where it took me like 18 chapters to get to the point LOL.
--- Quote from: nicksgal on June 27, 2021, 06:31:26 PM ---It might not be you, I might have been off on my math! I guessed around 2003 (which is fairly close to 2004), but couldn't remember if you'd finished Broken by then or not. Was Guilty Roads the one that had won that poll or was it a different one? I get starting #2, you've gotta love a good reincarnation plotline. Did you do these types of polls often or was this more of a one time thing?
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No, I think I said it was 2001 or 2002 and was off by a couple years. I was happy I could still click on the results of that poll and see them! Guilty Roads/Austere Refuge actually came in 4th place. The winning idea was the Brian romance, Divergence, which evolved into an idea called Surrender My Heart that I still have a folder for in the Future Stories section of my bookmarks. It's there waiting for me if I ever feel like writing a historical romance AU or OF, but I have not had that urge LOL. I enjoy history, but not so much historical fiction. That was also the problem with the reincarnation idea, which was going to take place partly during the Civil War. I loved that damn reincarnation idea and also still have bookmarks saved for it. It evolved into a Brian idea since that poll, though, which lists it as an AJ one LOL. Sorry, AJ. I actually have a decent start to an outline and eight pages of actual story written for that one too, but for whatever reason, I stopped writing it in the middle of Chapter 1 and never went back to it. According to my notes, the last time I added anything to the outline was in 2013, which was a WADD year for me. I eventually started SAMS toward the end of that summer, so I guess that's why I never went back to the reincarnation one.
I love doing polls like that, but don't do them very often. Besides this one, I only remember doing one other where I described several ideas I was considering and asked readers to vote. That was in the summer of 2017, after I finished SAMS and was having major WADD trying to figure out what to write next. http://dreamers-sanctuary.com/2017-07-01/ I actually have since finished two of the four ideas on this one (#1 was Heroic Measures, #2 was A Heart that Isn't Mine) and am working on a third (#3 was My Brother's Keeper). And #4 is the same Brian horror story I wrote the first scene for earlier this year. So either I'm getting better at bringing ideas into fruition, or I just have fewer ideas to choose from these days LOL.
--- Quote from: nicksgal on June 27, 2021, 06:31:26 PM ---They're your AJ compared to Nick, lol. "Hey, if you've got time, I have some stuff to do... No pressure." versus "I'MMMMM BAAAACCCCKKKK, ALLLRIIGHT!" I get it. I felt the same way about my little holiday story as Bethlehem. I could have written it for this Christmas, but the time just seemed right last year. :) I like the patiently naggy ones. They feel much more comforting.
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LOL Yes! Glad you jumped on your holiday story and got it written when the time felt right. I did not do that with the fourth pandaskunk story idea I had last year (well, I started it, but did not finish it), and now half the idea won't work anymore unless I still set it in 2020. But since I wrote the others all in the year they take place in, that takes some of the fun out of it. This must be how the Boys feel about failing to deliver a Christmas album year after year LOL. It's such a time-sensitive thing, and they are not good with being timely. But hopefully this is the year!
--- Quote from: nicksgal on June 27, 2021, 06:31:26 PM ---Your poor whipped cream, lol! I'd asked for one for our wedding, but I think I haven't been thinking about it because we just don't have space for it on our counter or in our cabinets. Once I get back to organizing, maybe I can make some space for it though. I like the yellow one. I keep vaguely telling hubs that a yellow kitchen would be nice, but then he reminds me that I also want a yellow house. I know better than to ask for AJ's pink kitchen, haha.
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I love yellow! My kitchen is yellow! Aside from my soon-to-be-redecorated guest bathroom, it's the only room in my house I didn't repaint when I moved in because I fell in love with the bright yellow walls the first time I looked at the house. I decorated it with teal and red accents, and it's so colorful and cute. It makes me happy. So I say go for the yellow kitchen and the yellow house! A pink kitchen would be super cute too, but yellow is probably a better option for the hubs LOL.
--- Quote from: nicksgal on June 27, 2021, 06:31:26 PM ---Yes, can't wait! "Redrum" would really pop if the background was beige or neutral, just saying, lol. I wonder if you could cover up the screw holes with some other picture.
I know, I'd temporarily forgotten about it, but knew it was up your alley. There's also the actual Stanley Hotel if you're doing an epic Colorado tourist trip, lol. I'm glad you did. I would expect nothing less for this "Shining" bathroom.
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So this is my other dilemma. I'm planning to put REDRUM on the back of the door, cause he writes it on a door in the movie, but in the movie, the door is white. My bathroom door is currently stained wood, not painted. It's pretty the way it is and goes with the current bathroom better than white would, but REDRUM would definitely pop more on a white door. So I have to decide if I want to paint it or not. I can definitely cover up the screw holes in the walls with artwork, but not the places where the paint is peeling a bit.
I would love to visit the Stanley too! I definitely need to plan a vacation to Colorado sometime - so much to see!
--- Quote from: nicksgal on June 27, 2021, 06:31:26 PM ---Do you often have ideas that come up in the moment as your writing or do most of them end up in the outline ahead of time?
You're probably right on all of that. And Charlotte's Web is so sad, so I can imagine being doubly sad if the scene itself is sad.
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The big ideas are usually planned in advance in the outline, but I come up with a lot of little things on the spot as I'm writing. I'm counting on that happening in the Kevin chapter I barely started today because I'm worried it's gonna be a boring one otherwise LOL.
--- Quote from: nicksgal on June 27, 2021, 06:31:26 PM ---...Heroes thrust together by destiny, lol. I think of all the things I've cut, the brotherly relationship and Nick as is are what's been most important to keep for me. It's just really not the same story without it. Now I've had to tweak it some to make it feel more earned, but on a whole, it's been preserved.
LOL! I get that. I wanted to keep Nick the same because he's my tiny muse. And I could see myself flubbing it up if I renamed him more than the others.
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Heroes thrust together by destiny - absolutely! I mean, that's basically what they are in real life LOL. As far as their relationship goes, my favorite AU I've written is Song for the Undead because it has the found family trope. Other than Brian and Kevin, none of them knew each other at the beginning, but they developed that bond as the story went on.
Gotta keep your muse's name the same!
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